Making elves for GURPS

[Ashtagon]

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

Noble, wise, perfect in nearly every way elves are rather boring and heavily classist. I don't think they appeal to modern audiences, for the most part. They may work as adversaries in a common underprivileged people rising up motif, but that's probably not what you meant.
As to Tolkein, I feel that they were altered a bit for the movies. There they were no wiser as a species than anyone else. But boy did they have the arrogance of stereotypical royalty.

The LotR movie elves came across as Kromm elves.

[Astromancer]

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

Noble, wise, perfect in nearly every way elves are rather boring and heavily classist. I don't think they appeal to modern audiences, for the most part. They may work as adversaries in a common underprivileged people rising up motif, but that's probably not what you meant.
As to Tolkein, I feel that they were altered a bit for the movies. There they were no wiser as a species than anyone else. But boy did they have the arrogance of stereotypical royalty.

Nobles that are truly noble and also very real faults and failings make for good drama. Besides, if you can't be a grown-up by the time your 250 years old, is there any hope for you?

[whswhs]

Tolkien tells us that there's a saying in Middle-Earth: "Go not to the elves for counsel, for they will say both No and Yes." So I think the reverence with which they're regarded has its limits.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

As to Tolkein, I feel that they were altered a bit for the movies. There they were no wiser as a species than anyone else. But boy did they have the arrogance of stereotypical royalty.

Tolkien elves in general were not notably wise; look at the elves in the Hobbit or the Silmarillion. For that matter, I don't recall particular wisdom from the unnamed elves in LoTR, and I'm not convinced Legolas was all that wise either.

[Rupert]

Originally Posted by Astromancer

Does anyone create noble wise elves anymore? Or does that get you in trouble with the Tolkien estate?

The elfs in my old fantasy world were not super-wise, though as they lived a very long time some become very wise (other just became very set in their ways - why change something that has worked for centuries?)

The original elfs were unaging, noble of physique, appearance, and manner, endowed with great magical talent and power, and great intellect, but they weren't notable wise, as a species. After all, they created Humans, and were almost exterminated by their creation.

The modern elfs are split into three groups:

The so-called 'High Elfs' who claim to be the rightful heirs of the original Elfs and who ape how they imagine their ancestors to have lived - in beautiful towns and estates in secluded lands, kept up by slaves where magic isn't enough.

The 'Wood Elfs' who live in villages surrounded by carefully managed forests and a little farmland. They trade with Dwarfs to get metalwork, and with neighbouring Humans for agricultural products that they can't or won't grow themselves. They like hunting, and some of them are okay with hunting people who trespass into Elfen land, and some land claimed by Elfs long, long ago has since been settled by Humans because 'the Elfs weren't using it', and as far as the less friendly Elfs are concerned the people on that land have given consent to be hunted and be otherwise mistreated simply be being there.

The 'Wild Elfs' are a reclusive 'back to nature' group who live a nomadic existence in the centre of a huge forest (once continent-wise) that they have not much improved. They are not friendly to intruders, including other Elfs, unless those Elfs have come to join them in their return to a 'natural' state. They have a low level of technology, but do indulge in a very small amount of trade with Dwarfs for metal artefacts (mostly knives and arrowheads). They use heavy longbows optimised for short-range power rather than range. As many of them are centuries old, and they live mostly as hunter-gatherers, their hunters are often very good shots. Putting arrow through eye-slits is almost a trademark.

[Cowrie]

I remembered another version of elves I've done. Gynodioecious (has females and hermaphrodites, but no males), elitist, slave-keeping ones with Lecherousness, Gluttony and a tendency to eat non-elf sapients. Alive and whole. They were basically a cruel ruling class for the setting, but very few non-elves objected, due to a sort of magical pheromone they produced that made others want to obey them. On top of that, they had regular magery, were physically strong, fast and agile, and were immortal (the most common causes of death for elves in this setting were duels with other elves, ritual suicide to maintain honor, and execution by the state, which says something). Physically, they were feminine, stunningly beautiful, slender, with skin tones ranging from pale-but-human-looking to light grey to bright white with a blue or purple sheen. Hair colors were always pale, but could be blonde, silver, white, light red, or very light brown, and eyes could be just about any gemstone tone.

They're actually from a freeform text rp, but I liked them so much I statted them up for GURPS and, while I haven't used them since, I swear someday I will run a game with those elves as evil overlords. They're sort of built for it.

[Rupert]

Originally Posted by Cowrie

They're actually from a freeform text rp, but I liked them so much I statted them up for GURPS and, while I haven't used them since, I swear someday I will run a game with those elves as evil overlords. They're sort of built for it.

One sub-group of my Elfs, that I didn't mention, were the followers and assistants of the guy who created Humans. They were expelled from Elfen society for impiety and blasphemy because created a sapient species was something reserved to the gods. It turned out that this was because doing so was one of the steps along the road to apotheosis.

This faction ended up in one of the hells, their leader a god, and promptly took it over, being a lot more organised than the local demons. For their strongholds in this hell they mount raids on the the world to carry out vengeance against the other Elfs for casting them out, against Humans for not worshipping their creator any more, against Dwarfs for reasons even they no longer remember, and against everyone else for being 'goblins' (and thus too ugly to be allowed to live). They also raid for slaves, because they are obviously far too noble to be expected to actually work, and they need a continuous supply because the hells are not good places to breed mortals and they go through a lot of slaves due to abuse and general mistreatment.

They are very much Not Nice, as you'd expect from demonic elves.

[jason taylor]

Originally Posted by Flyndaran

Noble, wise, perfect in nearly every way elves are rather boring and heavily classist. I don't think they appeal to modern audiences, for the most part. They may work as adversaries in a common underprivileged people rising up motif, but that's probably not what you meant.
As to Tolkein, I feel that they were altered a bit for the movies. There they were no wiser as a species than anyone else. But boy did they have the arrogance of stereotypical royalty.

I can't remember anything MUNDANE about them except the wood elves getting drunk. Even their vices seem lofty.

[ericthered]

Originally Posted by Astromancer

Does anyone create noble wise elves anymore? Or does that get you in trouble with the Tolkien estate?

The wise and noble aspect of the elves shines through a little in Tolkien's works, but I think that's a lesser aspect of their more essential feature of age. They remember a long time ago, and they've seen a lot in their time. That ought to make them more wise, and you're hard pressed to find an example of an elf doing something stupid.



I do think that wise, noble, and graceful is sufficient to make one an elf. But the "elves" that seem to invoke that feel the most are vulcans and other space elves.

[Daigoro]

Note that the Peter Jackson elves look a lot different to Ralph Bakshi's.

They're the green guys here:

The Hobbit (1977) - The Battle of the Five Armies