08-03-2020, 09:12 PM | #11 |
Join Date: Dec 2013
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Re: In which I post about a TL9 solar system
The first mining operations, I think, would consist of building cargo ships out of the asteroid, slapping an engine and fuel tank on ship, then having it automate itself to the destination. Orbital mechanics and obstacle avoidance are relatively simple enough that a modern desktop can handle it; and governments and corporations can afford the programming expertise needed to do so.
The engines and computers themselves might be shipped back on those same cargo ships, for a fee. The guidance program itself would probably be a yearly licensing fee. Gouging corporations, combined with a lack of government oversight, means that much of the profit gained in sales, could be lost in buying various manufactured goods. A glut of materials would see prices drop; precipitously, for some goods - perhaps to the point that some miners are essentially indentured workers due to debt. That would provide one of the impetuses for the first solar war... |
08-03-2020, 09:13 PM | #12 |
Join Date: Feb 2016
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Re: In which I post about a TL9 solar system
You can do Saturn with TL9, you just need to build big (SM+14) for passive radiation protection and life support. Of course, that requires a massive space infrastructure, but that is not impossible, just unlikely without a really good economic or military reason. Uranus and Neptune are highly unlikely though, as they would take years.
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08-03-2020, 09:33 PM | #13 | |
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Re: In which I post about a TL9 solar system
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The ISS is inside Earth's magnetosphere which deflects most of the charged particles that make up cosmic rays. At NASA the people in charge of human factors are intensely woried about long term radiation. The people working on other aspects of a Mars mission are just hoping the human factors group solves their problem. Outside of NASA peole like Robert Zubrin are confident that they can find astronauts (or maybe "astronauts") who will make heroic sacrifices like dying of cancer after they get back to Earth.
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Fred Brackin |
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08-03-2020, 10:18 PM | #14 | |
Join Date: Dec 2013
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Re: In which I post about a TL9 solar system
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Edit: Some parts of this post has been edited, as I forgot about the Delta-V increase from having 6+ fuel tanks. This Delta-V increase lets us use only 6 fuel tanks across the entire Earth-Jupiter run Alright, so settlement routes (using Brachistochrone Transfer, assuming 0.005G acceleration; 1 Advanced Fusion Plasma Pulse reaction drive) would be: Earth->Mars = 39 days, 100 mps (5+1 extra fuel tanks). Mars->Inner Belt/Ceres = 51 days, 130 mps (6 fuel tanks, 14 mps extra). Edit: The Delta-V increase lets us drop from 7 to 6 fuel tanks. For the Inner Belt/Ceres to the *Jovian asteroid clouds, we have two options: 1. We use a Hohmann Transfer for Ceres to the *Jovian asteroid clouds: Inner Belt/Ceres->*Jovian asteroid clouds = 1,400 days, 3.1 mps. 2. Build two way-stations; one at 3.533~ AU, and another at 4.367~ AU. This would require fuel and supplies for both itself, and ships making the transit. The most expedient would seem to be to boost two sets of three sizable asteroids; one nickel-iron, one high in uranium, and one water-ice. From the inner belt, this will take 1,000 days and 1.4 mps for the first set, and 1,200 days and 2.4 mps for the second set, using Hohmann Transfers. About three and a third standard years later, the Ceres-Jupiter Transit Stations are in place. Provided sufficient initial asteroids are chosen, it should be at least ten years before further resupply should be scheduled. We then proceed to further Brachistochrone Transfers as outlined: Inner Belt/Ceres->Ceres-Jupiter Transit Station 1 = 45 days, (6 fuel tanks). Edit: The Delta-V increase lets us drop the extra 7th fuel tank (originally there to ensure we had any extra Delta-V at all). Ceres-Jupiter Transit Station 1->Ceres-Jupiter Transit Station 2 = 45 days, (6 extra fuel tanks). Edit: The Delta-V increase lets us drop the extra 7th fuel tank (originally there to ensure we had any extra Delta-V at all). Ceres-Jupiter Transit Station 2->Jovian asteroid cloud = 45 days, (6 fuel tanks). Edit: The Delta-V increase lets us drop the extra 7th fuel tank (originally there to ensure we had any extra Delta-V at all). 135 days after leaving Ceres, and 1,200 days after the start of the mission, we've arrived at Jupiter's orbital ring (not, it should be clarified, at Jupiter itself). Jupiter's orbital ring to Saturn requires either several dedicated asteroid stations, or a Hohmann Transfer taking about ten years, and 2.1 mps. Fortunately, we've arrived not just at one of Jupiter's orbital rings, but at one of its lagrangian asteroid clouds. * Jupiter has two asteroid clouds; one preceding it, and one following it, at about 60 degrees away on the orbital plane. This gets us out to Jupiter's orbit, while avoiding the radiation. Last edited by Say, it isn't that bad!; 08-04-2020 at 12:27 AM. |
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08-03-2020, 10:29 PM | #15 | |
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Sumter, SC
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Re: In which I post about a TL9 solar system
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Not everything has to be TL10. TL 10 Power Beamed Power and (advanced) Solar Cell should be on the table by 2200. Give the issues of radiation a Radscanner (TL10) should also be around. Explorer and Worker Swarms (TL10) would IMHO also be fast tracked (if a robot can do it why risk a human life?)
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Help make a digital reference for GURPS by coming to the GURPS wiki and provide some information and links (such as to various Fanmade 4e Bestiaries) . Please, provide more then just a title and a page number. Last edited by maximara; 08-03-2020 at 10:45 PM. |
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08-03-2020, 10:29 PM | #16 | ||||
Join Date: Dec 2013
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Re: In which I post about a TL9 solar system
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Although there's also Hardened in Spaceships 1, which I slapped on for reasons of "armour's cheap". B47 would suggest that would change the AD (100) to AD (10), but that seems... questionable? To be honest, I'm not quite sure how Armour Divisor modifiers work in the specific case between (10) and (100). Quote:
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And I think that's all I'll say about that here. |
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08-03-2020, 10:44 PM | #17 | ||||
Join Date: Dec 2013
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Re: In which I post about a TL9 solar system
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We seem to be hitting that wall right now; Global Foundries has dropped out of the nanometer race entirely, and Intel has had a lot of trouble getting past 14nm. Transhuman Space, on the other hand, presupposes abundant, powerful computers on a massive scale. Also, nanobot technology has a number of hurdles (some listed in the books) which mean that it's less-modest claims should be chewed and considered, but perhaps not swallowed (just yet). Quote:
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But yes - automation is definitely used; when I say "miner", it should be read as "educated technician directing robots" (edit: or driving a vehicle), something I should have made clear. Also, I will edit the date and tech level. A lot of stuff to respond to... Last edited by Say, it isn't that bad!; 08-03-2020 at 10:55 PM. |
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08-03-2020, 10:54 PM | #18 | |
Join Date: Feb 2016
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Re: In which I post about a TL9 solar system
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08-03-2020, 11:24 PM | #19 | ||
On Notice
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Sumter, SC
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Re: In which I post about a TL9 solar system
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Though we are going to hit the quantum tunelling wall soon even with functional prototype 3 nm chips supposedly due out in 2021 (Apple's planned A16 is supposed to be 3 nm and be out in 2022). I'm not sure if the gate-all-around FETs for 2nm chips is going to pan out and that may be the limit with RISC based instruction sets. To go faster and cooler quantum computing will have to become a thing and that is so much on the theory side it is not even funny. Quote:
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Help make a digital reference for GURPS by coming to the GURPS wiki and provide some information and links (such as to various Fanmade 4e Bestiaries) . Please, provide more then just a title and a page number. Last edited by maximara; 08-04-2020 at 12:27 AM. |
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08-03-2020, 11:31 PM | #20 | |
Join Date: Dec 2013
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Re: In which I post about a TL9 solar system
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I'm using an auto-calculating spreadsheet that seems to have come with "Pyramid 3/079:Space Atlas" to calculate transfer times. It seems lacking on places to enter the minimum or maximum delta-V you're using. Tolerances over time; although I'd worry more about peak exposure. |
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solar system, space, tl9 |
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