Catalog of the Weird Parallels

[TGLS]

Originally Posted by maximara

The Sheldrake Section has one major issue: they know of a world where manaless magic works (Rome-6) and yet no work or even explanation of this form of magic is even touched on.

Actually, Rome-6 is normal-mana. The only example I can think of is Taft-1, and they don't know about Taft-1 magic yet.

[maximara]

Originally Posted by TGLS

Actually, Rome-6 is normal-mana. The only example I can think of is Taft-1, and they don't know about Taft-1 magic yet.

I didn't say that Rome-6 didn't have mana. I said it has manaless magic. Big difference.

"These offerings create areas with heightened sanctity levels. Each inhabited place has a sacred perimeter called the pomoerium, often marked by a ditch or a line of stones. The land it encloses has normal sanctity. The land outside it has low sanctity." (GURPS Fantasy 198) Note it states Sanctity not mana.

"In a high-sanctity site such as a temple, or a temporarily consecrated site elsewhere, anyone who knows the spell can cast it. Elsewhere, only a person specially favored by the god with Power Investiture 1 or better can do so." GURPS Fantasy 203) Power Investiture not Magery

More over there is this: "The ground within a city’s pomoerium is a low-mana area." (GURPS Fantasy 207)

So mana and sanctity based magic co-exist and yet Homeline seem to only know of Mana based magic.
I could understand this if Homeline had only recently discovered magic; they would be on par with someone at late TL4 being shown electricity...and then basically left to their own devices to understand and use it.

The thing I don't except by this stage of the game they don't realize that they understanding of magic is off kilter.

Originally Posted by Mysterious Dark Lord v3.2

The Shelldrake boys just need to look at their problem in another light (i.e. stop trying to find a "grand unified theory of mumbo-jumbo").

Why would they even do that? If anything their understanding of "magic" (before they got someone who could give them better information aka their Merlin-1 vampire) should have been more along lines of 3e Ritual Magic ie effectively where Merlin-1 should have been at in the late 1940s to early 1950s.

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by maximara

I didn't say that Rome-6 didn't have mana. I said it has manaless magic. Big difference.

"These offerings create areas with heightened sanctity levels. Each inhabited place has a sacred perimeter called the pomoerium, often marked by a ditch or a line of stones. The land it encloses has normal sanctity. The land outside it has low sanctity." (GURPS Fantasy 198) Note it states Sanctity not mana.

"In a high-sanctity site such as a temple, or a temporarily consecrated site elsewhere, anyone who knows the spell can cast it. Elsewhere, only a person specially favored by the god with Power Investiture 1 or better can do so." GURPS Fantasy 203) Power Investiture not Magery

More over there is this: "The ground within a city’s pomoerium is a low-mana area." (GURPS Fantasy 207)

So mana and sanctity based magic co-exist and yet Homeline seem to only know of Mana based magic.
.

<shrug> Actually it's pretty clear that in Roma Arcana sanctity and mana are the same thing. Sanctity is just mana that has been sequestered by the gods.

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by ericthered

...
I run ISWAT almost independently of the ICops. ISWAT knows about Infinity, receives money from them, accepts promising recruits, and occasionally runs the odd favor for them. But ISWAT only deals with world-shaking threats, and they certainly don't take ORDERS from suits in chicago. The Infinity-Centrum conflict comes across as petty and short-sighted but understandable. If you want, you can tie this in with the secret.

I think they're mostly played like the difference between highly competent special forces and the Justice League. Massively different scope and commonality of the insanely "rare" powers and threats.

[maximara]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

<shrug> Actually it's pretty clear that in Roma Arcana sanctity and mana are the same thing. Sanctity is just mana that has been sequestered by the gods.

Actually "base" Sanctity and Mana powered magic work differently even in 4e GURPS.

Also at least one deity (Isis) effectively says 'screw this Power Investiture/Sanctity tap dance. I'll just require my clerics to have/learn magery and have them use mana.'

More over, "Magic in Roma Arcana is either ritual magic, based on an underlying skill, or clerical magic, granted by a god or powerful spirit (see p. B242). Mages always have Ritual Magery."

This is at odds with the kind of magic system they learned from Merlin-1 so this should be causing them to question any theories about magic working along any one set of "rules".

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by maximara

Actually "base" Sanctity and Mana powered magic work differently even in 4e GURPS.

Also at least one deity (Isis) effectively says 'screw this Power Investiture/Sanctity tap dance. I'll just require my clerics to have/learn magery and have them use mana.'

More over, "Magic in Roma Arcana is either ritual magic, based on an underlying skill, or clerical magic, granted by a god or powerful spirit (see p. B242). Mages always have Ritual Magery."

This is at odds with the kind of magic system they learned from Merlin-1 so this should be causing them to question any theories about magic working along any one set of "rules".

I don't think it's really an issue for them. While ritual magic based on mana is a different way of applying the power source it's still the same power source and our hypothetical mana detecting rock would still ping on the existence of the power source itself. Of course if they pop into a world where all "magic" is Sanctity based the rocks useless even if they tell themselves that Sanctity is a kind of altered mana.

[maximara]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

I don't think it's really an issue for them. While ritual magic based on mana is a different way of applying the power source it's still the same power source and our hypothetical mana detecting rock would still ping on the existence of the power source itself. Of course if they pop into a world where all "magic" is Sanctity based the rocks useless even if they tell themselves that Sanctity is a kind of altered mana.

The pomoerium has a very interesting situation of being both normal Sanctity and Low Mana. If our hypothetical mana detecting rock has a Power of 15 then it is going to not show anything in both Low and No mana areas. (You need a Power 20 or higher for that per GURPS Magic pg 17)

The rock shows mana doesn't exist (where are they going to get a Enchanter who can pump out an Power 20 item?) able but they see spells being cast. That alone should tell them it is time to go back to the hypothesis drawing board.

[AlexanderHowl]

There are also timelines known to Infinity with magic that lack mana, which causes headaches for both Infinity and the Cabal (Infinite Worlds, p. 22). The magic of those worlds transcend mana and function by using spirits (Path/Book magic or RPM), directly manipulating reality (Flexible Magic or Threshold-Limited Magic), or function in ways not understood by either Infinity or the Cabal. With an infinity of timelines, the only constant seems to be that there are tendencies rather than constants between timelines.

[maximara]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl

There are also timelines known to Infinity with magic that lack mana, which causes headaches for both Infinity and the Cabal (Infinite Worlds, p. 22). The magic of those worlds transcend mana and function by using spirits (Path/Book magic or RPM), directly manipulating reality (Flexible Magic or Threshold-Limited Magic), or function in ways not understood by either Infinity or the Cabal. With an infinity of timelines, the only constant seems to be that there are tendencies rather than constants between timelines.

The thing is if you think about them they really aren't alternate "timelines" but parallel realities ala DC's old Earth-One and Earth-Thirty-Two (which resembled the Post-Crisis New Earth in having both a JSA and JLA).

Once you realize you are dealing with parallel realities rather then a 'what-if? divergence' then you have the nasty issue of possible alternate physical laws which many of the realities both Infinity and the Cabal know about actually have.

For example, sure Etheria has has a divergence at 1824 but it is only because of alternate physical laws that the divergence had that allowed the luminiferous aether to exist as well as Venus and Mars to have breathable atmospheres.

[Astromancer]

Try this...

A superhero world where all non-supers are aware of plot conventions but none of the superheroes or supervillains are. The sidekicks are in the know and generally work to aid/protect "their hero" or "their villain."

Communities and government agencies take a pragmatic view. Dark Vigilantes and bloodthirsty villains they crack down on. Most of the rest are simply seen as loose cannons that either need to be aimed or lashed down.

Some Villain/Hero types ( like Deadpool, Harlequin, or Ambush Bug) have a limited awareness of what's going on. They are careful to do things like read their comic book or check out their Wikipedia page. The authorities are of two minds about this. These semi-aware types are generally nuts, but they are semi-aware, so use may be extracted.

Any world hoppers will be seen as either heroes or villains by the locals. Becoming clued in to the local rules will terrify those around the PCs.