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Old 09-13-2015, 06:20 PM   #11
mlangsdorf
 
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Default Re: Partial Fix of Magic: Fire College

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Originally Posted by scc View Post
@mlangsdorf interesting point about the advanced uses, maybe shift to something like IQ+1 or +2? As for Explosive Fireball, that being a separate spell is part of the problem.
Under the standard system, Explosive Fireball is a separate problem that I can purchase, if I decide I need it, for 1 skill point, and have at a reasonable skill (usually 13-19 for most point budgets).

Under your system, Explosive Fireball is rolled into Fireball, but I can't use it unless I spend enough points to get Fireball-20. For the typical 150-250 point game, my wizard has IQ 14-16 and Magery 3-5, and to get Explosive Fireball needs to spend 1-15 points. which isn't affordable at all for low point value game.

Spending 11 more points to get the same marginally useful spell effect is a detriment. Especially since I suspect that when you try to write up your revised spell list with proper formating, you're not really saving all that much line count.
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Old 09-13-2015, 09:38 PM   #12
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Default Re: Partial Fix of Magic: Fire College

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Originally Posted by mlangsdorf View Post
Spending 11 more points to get the same marginally useful spell effect is a detriment. Especially since I suspect that when you try to write up your revised spell list with proper formating, you're not really saving all that much line count.
Compared to Magic as is? Yes. But once you take that comparison out 11-12 points or so for a roughly 3d explosive burning attack that can be charged to three times it's average level with a bit of time doesn't seem all that bad.

Magic needs more reasons like this to spend more on the spells, rather than simply Magery and IQ, to stop promoting the 1 point spell builds.
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Old 09-14-2015, 09:12 AM   #13
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Default Re: Partial Fix of Magic: Fire College

While I agree that Magic needs a revamp (and I've written a revamp) to change the value of IQ and Magery and single point spells, I don't know that a 3d bu ex attack is worth 11+ points.

That's a bit of a simplification. The first 3d bu ex attack is probably worth closer to 20+ points. The problem is that the second 3d-3 bu ex attack isn't worth 20+ points - it's an alternate ability of the first attack, and worth 1/5th the cost. And so on and so forth for every advanced ability: they're drastically overpriced as soon as you have more than 2 or 3 of them.

Regardless, the proposed revamp is going to confuse experienced players, who are going to wonder why they can't cheaply learn some spells, and other spells get vastly expanded utility (ie, Summon and/or Control Elemental).
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Old 10-11-2015, 02:39 AM   #14
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Default Re: Partial Fix of Magic: Fire College

OK, I've done some more work along these lines, revising most of the missile spells, or at least those that do damage, into a single spell. Note that the spell below has no college.

Please post any additional techniques/damage options you can think up.

Energy Ball (VH) Missile
Creates a normally small ball of whatever desired energy or other effect in the plam of your hand. The ball has 1/2D 20, max 40, ACC 2. Every time you cast this spell you MUST use one of the techniques listed below, damage listed is per point of energy put into the spell. Each is Hard, with a Defualt of spell - 0.

Acid
1d cor

Fire*
1d burn

Ice*
1d cur, melts into water upon impact, putting out fires in hex

Knife
1d cut or any pi

Lingtning*
1d-1 burn sur, Metalic DR is treated as DR 1. If the tagret is wounded, make a HT roll at -1 per 2 HP lost or be stunned.

Sun
1d burn (This is tight beam burning damage)

Strike Zone*
1d cut or any pi

* Large-Area damage effect, may not target location, but if effective skill is attribute (IQ + Magery) then spell may be cast expolsivly, it may be targeted at a Hex for +4. The target and anyone closer then a single yard take full damage, those further away divide damage by three times their distance in yards from the explosion (round down).
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Old 10-11-2015, 01:06 PM   #15
simply Nathan
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Default Re: Partial Fix of Magic: Fire College

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Knife
1d cut or any pi

Strike Zone*
1d cut or any pi
Why pi and not imp?
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Old 10-11-2015, 05:47 PM   #16
scc
 
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Default Re: Partial Fix of Magic: Fire College

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Why pi and not imp?
Pi++ is the same as imp
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Old 10-11-2015, 06:55 PM   #17
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Default Re: Partial Fix of Magic: Fire College

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Pi++ is the same as imp
Not really. It interacts differently with injury tolerances and DR.
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Old 10-11-2015, 08:22 PM   #18
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Default Re: Partial Fix of Magic: Fire College

I'm going to need page number for that, Bruno
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Old 10-11-2015, 08:27 PM   #19
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Default Re: Partial Fix of Magic: Fire College

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I'm going to need page number for that, Bruno
Basic Page 46: piercing (including huge piercing) is a separate class of Limited Defenses from impaling.
Basic Page 282: Explanation that some equipment has different DR scores for different kinds of damage.
Basic Page 285: Footnote [1] indicates this armor has a different DR score for cutting and piercing vs all other damage types.

Powers page 53: Injury Tolerance Damage Reduction uses Limited Defenses from Basic page 46, just like DR. Which means that piercing (including huge piercing) is a separate class of Limited Defenses from impaling.
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Old 10-11-2015, 08:42 PM   #20
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Default Re: Partial Fix of Magic: Fire College

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Originally Posted by Bruno View Post
Basic Page 46: piercing (including huge piercing) is a separate class of Limited Defenses from impaling.
Basic Page 282: Explanation that some equipment has different DR scores for different kinds of damage.
Basic Page 285: Footnote [1] indicates this armor has a different DR score for cutting and piercing vs all other damage types.

Powers page 53: Injury Tolerance Damage Reduction uses Limited Defenses from Basic page 46, just like DR. Which means that piercing (including huge piercing) is a separate class of Limited Defenses from impaling.
If I remember correctly, there are armors in Basic Set, Ultra-Tech, and High-Tech that have different DR scores if the damage type is impaling as opposed to piercing. I don't have my books open right now to check, though.
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