Lesser Wish: $74

hcobb · 10-01-2018, 06:30 PM

IQ18 wizard makes $250 per week. Hire him for one hour for $7.

10 fatigue to cast and maintain Pentagram plus 20 fatigue to summon a lesser demon adds $30.

Of course this is dangerous work so the cost is doubled (ITL 64) to $74

Wayne · 10-01-2018, 08:26 PM

I'll buy a dozen!

Skarg · 10-02-2018, 12:48 AM

Good point.

Seems really cheap and all in all, too easy to achieve, to me.

(I'd probably have demons in my campaigns tend to have less predictable IQs and qualities, and/or IQs more like original TFT demons...)

I think the guild rate for "dangerous work" is just a starting point, and whether you can actually find a wizard willing to do any particular job, and for how much, would depend upon the wizard in question.

So... if you were an IQ 18 wizard, who had Summon Lesser Demon and other IQ 18 spells and other IQ 18 interests, how likely would you be to be willing to do this work for $74, knowing that it has about a 1% chance you'll die? How much would you want to be paid to risk a 1% chance of death? How many times would you be willing to do that job?

(Personally, I rather like my life, and would like it even more if I were an IQ 18 wizard. As an IQ 18 wizard, I think I could find other ways to earn money that I'd rather do, and would need to be paid a huge sum to risk my life that way. I'm curious what others would answer, though.)

Tenex · 10-02-2018, 04:00 AM

I think the cost could be increased to reflect all the security that would have to be in place for this. No wizard, especially the 40 point kind with the latest cap, is going to want to fight a lesser demon by himself. So if you work in the cost of security, i.e. 10-20 solid fighters, the cost goes up. Maybe a non-refundable security deposit for all the nice things in the room that an angry demon might wreck. Add in the cost for other wizard's to maintain diamondskin and blur on the summoning wizard.

In the end, even that doesn't seem to raise the price enough.

I disagree with the 1% chance of death though. If cast by a lone wizard in a tower by himself, then yeah, probably. But any rational wizard wouldn't cast this without a lot of security in place.

Re risking ones life for money... All it means is you have to look harder. Not every IQ 18 wizard will go for this, but some percentage (GM wild whimsical guess) will. Plenty of high IQ people are risk takers.

Chris Rice · 10-02-2018, 04:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tenex

I think the cost could be increased to reflect all the security that would have to be in place for this. No wizard, especially the 40 point kind with the latest cap, is going to want to fight a lesser demon by himself. So if you work in the cost of security, i.e. 10-20 solid fighters, the cost goes up. Maybe a non-refundable security deposit for all the nice things in the room that an angry demon might wreck. Add in the cost for other wizard's to maintain diamondskin and blur on the summoning wizard.

In the end, even that doesn't seem to raise the price enough.

I disagree with the 1% chance of death though. If cast by a lone wizard in a tower by himself, then yeah, probably. But any rational wizard wouldn't cast this without a lot of security in place.

Re risking ones life for money... All it means is you have to look harder. Not every IQ 18 wizard will go for this, but some percentage (GM wild whimsical guess) will. Plenty of high IQ people are risk takers.

Wizards don't work by the hour 😜😜😜😜

Tenex · 10-02-2018, 04:05 AM

Why not? Lawyers do.

It's still cheap if you pay him a weeks salary.

Chris Rice · 10-02-2018, 04:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tenex

Why not? Lawyers do.

It's still cheap if you pay him a weeks salary.

For a start off, Wizards are rarer and a lot more useful than lawyers, to my mind anyway. In addition, as PCs will often be laden with gold and treasure, Wizards will charge what they think the market will bear for their services. The costs in the book are just a starting point for the novice GM. Anyone who runs a longer standing game will need to modify these costs to take into account their developing game world. If the players are regularly pulling large amounts of treasure from the Labyrinth and then paying Wizards peanut prices for magic items and spells to aid them in their quests, then costs will inevitably rise.

hcobb · 10-02-2018, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Rice

Wizards don't work by the hour ��

ITL p.60
"For a simple job of spell-casting at the wizard’s shop or office, you will be charged by the hour (for the wizard’s time, not his apprentices’). The hourly rate is 1/8 of the daily rate, with a minimum one-hour charge. If supplies are needed, the wizard will charge extra for them; there will also be a fee of $1 for each ST point used in the casting."

Note that by ITL p.143 the wizard has to fail by 10 points on two six die rolls in order to be dusted. Hence it's nowhere near as dangerous as being an Uber driver.

larsdangly · 10-02-2018, 09:44 AM

I also noticed that the suggested pricing for employing powerful wizards was going to lead to everyone effectively having open access to lots and lots of powerful effects. I think I just won't mention it to my players - they are not the most attentive bunch so I'm sure it won't occur to them that they could swap their starting cash for a dozen limited wishes.

The Wyzard · 10-02-2018, 10:04 AM

Most RPG rules that are sufficiently complex will eventually run into edge cases like this. I think it's fair to have a table rule called "don't demand nonsense."

Wizards are going to demand a whole lot to cast a spell that might get them killed on a couple bad rolls, or may always demand more than money.

At least, that's my view of it. Maybe I'm wrong.

EDIT: Do you get to fight the demon if you lose the battle of wills? Like does the game actually go into combat mode? Because I had thought from skimming it that if you blew those rolls, it killed you with some kind of mental backlash. Having a team of guys with pikes and whatnot wouldn't help.

10-01-2018, 06:30 PM	#1
hcobb Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Pacheco, California	Lesser Wish: $74 IQ18 wizard makes $250 per week. Hire him for one hour for $7. 10 fatigue to cast and maintain Pentagram plus 20 fatigue to summon a lesser demon adds $30. Of course this is dangerous work so the cost is doubled (ITL 64) to $74 __________________ -HJC

10-01-2018, 08:26 PM	#2
Wayne Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Geelong, Australia	Re: Lesser Wish: $74 I'll buy a dozen!

10-02-2018, 12:48 AM	#3
Skarg Join Date: May 2015	Re: Lesser Wish: $74 Good point. Seems really cheap and all in all, too easy to achieve, to me. (I'd probably have demons in my campaigns tend to have less predictable IQs and qualities, and/or IQs more like original TFT demons...) I think the guild rate for "dangerous work" is just a starting point, and whether you can actually find a wizard willing to do any particular job, and for how much, would depend upon the wizard in question. So... if you were an IQ 18 wizard, who had Summon Lesser Demon and other IQ 18 spells and other IQ 18 interests, how likely would you be to be willing to do this work for $74, knowing that it has about a 1% chance you'll die? How much would you want to be paid to risk a 1% chance of death? How many times would you be willing to do that job? (Personally, I rather like my life, and would like it even more if I were an IQ 18 wizard. As an IQ 18 wizard, I think I could find other ways to earn money that I'd rather do, and would need to be paid a huge sum to risk my life that way. I'm curious what others would answer, though.)

10-02-2018, 04:00 AM	#4
Tenex Join Date: Aug 2018	Re: Lesser Wish: $74 I think the cost could be increased to reflect all the security that would have to be in place for this. No wizard, especially the 40 point kind with the latest cap, is going to want to fight a lesser demon by himself. So if you work in the cost of security, i.e. 10-20 solid fighters, the cost goes up. Maybe a non-refundable security deposit for all the nice things in the room that an angry demon might wreck. Add in the cost for other wizard's to maintain diamondskin and blur on the summoning wizard. In the end, even that doesn't seem to raise the price enough. I disagree with the 1% chance of death though. If cast by a lone wizard in a tower by himself, then yeah, probably. But any rational wizard wouldn't cast this without a lot of security in place. Re risking ones life for money... All it means is you have to look harder. Not every IQ 18 wizard will go for this, but some percentage (GM wild whimsical guess) will. Plenty of high IQ people are risk takers.

10-02-2018, 04:05 AM	#6
Tenex Join Date: Aug 2018	Re: Lesser Wish: $74 Why not? Lawyers do. It's still cheap if you pay him a weeks salary.

10-02-2018, 09:44 AM	#9
larsdangly Join Date: Dec 2017	Re: Lesser Wish: $74 I also noticed that the suggested pricing for employing powerful wizards was going to lead to everyone effectively having open access to lots and lots of powerful effects. I think I just won't mention it to my players - they are not the most attentive bunch so I'm sure it won't occur to them that they could swap their starting cash for a dozen limited wishes.

10-02-2018, 10:04 AM	#10
The Wyzard Join Date: Jul 2018	Re: Lesser Wish: $74 Most RPG rules that are sufficiently complex will eventually run into edge cases like this. I think it's fair to have a table rule called "don't demand nonsense." Wizards are going to demand a whole lot to cast a spell that might get them killed on a couple bad rolls, or may always demand more than money. At least, that's my view of it. Maybe I'm wrong. EDIT: Do you get to fight the demon if you lose the battle of wills? Like does the game actually go into combat mode? Because I had thought from skimming it that if you blew those rolls, it killed you with some kind of mental backlash. Having a team of guys with pikes and whatnot wouldn't help.