Scenario Contest #10- Uncivil Engineers

[Jen]

Not that we're trying to start a fight or anything, but scenario #10, Uncivil Engineers is up for your enjoyment!

I'll close the thread for feedback on September 21, so give it a whirl!

Just as a note, the thread for feedback on Scenario #3, Salvage, will close on July 27, so if you've got input, we're down to the wire!

Thanks!
Jen

[GranitePenguin]

First impressions... this one is hard for the engineers. Really hard.

I love the old-school Breakthru feel of it, but it's too much of a bottleneck. I had a fair number of defense units that were set up in the backfield that never even got a chance to get close to the action. A wall along the railroad and INF in the town hexes mean there's nowhere to go. You basically get forced into slamming forward and hope you can at least disable some units early. My first game was over in 3 turns.

I really like the idea, but it isn't balanced at all.


Now for the notes.

This is a general statement about all the scenarios: The order of info should be consistent and should be in a logical progression. In particular, Map Setup (which maps, overlays, etc) should come before Unit selections and placement. It doesn't flow right if you describe how to set up units if you don't have the map set up yet. It doesn't matter too much after you have played a scenario a couple times, but the first time through when you are trying to wrap your head around an idea, order matters.


Overall, the layout of this one is pretty simple and to the point. Not much to nitpick.

The combine has captured a Paneuropean power plant intact, but not before it was sabotaged.

In the fluff text, combine should be capitalized.

The attacker moves first, entering on any hex(es) on lake in the SW corner of the map; the entry hex counts for movement, and any unit entering on the road may take road bonus if applicable.

The bolded text is unnecessary. There is no case where a unit can enter on the road hex at S1-0512; all units enter on the lake. Maybe the intent was to say that units are considered to have been on the water, so they get the road bonus?

The defender chooses up to 4 hexes to start the game as rubble.

In case it wasn't enough of a bottleneck, let's put rubble in the river or along the coastline of the lake. The GEVs get funneled into a *tiny* area that can just be pounded.


It's a great idea, we just need to get it balanced.

[GranitePenguin]

ok, I've tried a few things to balance this out, but haven't gotten there yet.

I tried removing the 6AU below the cutoff line (now everything starts above it) and got rid of the 4 rubble overlays. That helps a little; at least the attackers can get a toehold in the southern town (but they can't leave). The problem is they just get swarmed and jammed up, with nowhere good to go. If the defenders put GEVs at S1-1406, they can be in S1-0811 by the end of their first turn to block access and force an overrun. As soon as the road is cut, the movement for the GEV-PCs slows too much trying to get through.

I also tried limiting the force selection so the defense can't use long-range units (MHWZ, mostly). Again, slight improvement, but still can't get past turn 3 without getting torn up. The best I could do was using all LGEV. I made it to the railroad bridge before losing everything.

Basically, if you wait, you're dead. If you run for it, you are also dead. The next option is to reduce defense unit counts. I'm going to try 8 AU and 18 INF

[GranitePenguin]

Ok, this was much closer (engineers still lost, but not easily).

setup...
Defense: 8AU (all GEVs) and 18INF, set up all units behind the line.
Engineers: All GEVs
Overlays: none

results...
Turns: 5
Units left: 2 GEVs and 8 INF for the defense, all engineer units destroyed.

defense had to be much more conscious of attrition; they couldn't just walk in and take hits. It was a much more even exchange of fire, but the single-mindedness of the task for the defense still makes it too hard for the engineers to get through. All the defense needs is a small break in a screen to tear up the engineers and GEV-PCs.

I think a little more reduction in defensive forces (start with 6 AU and 15 INF) might just about do it.

[Jen]

Originally Posted by GranitePenguin

Ok, this was much closer (engineers still lost, but not easily).

setup...
Defense: 8AU (all GEVs) and 18INF, set up all units behind the line.
Engineers: All GEVs
Overlays: none

results...
Turns: 5
Units left: 2 GEVs and 8 INF for the defense, all engineer units destroyed.

defense had to be much more conscious of attrition; they couldn't just walk in and take hits. It was a much more even exchange of fire, but the single-mindedness of the task for the defense still makes it too hard for the engineers to get through. All the defense needs is a small break in a screen to tear up the engineers and GEV-PCs.

I think a little more reduction in defensive forces (start with 6 AU and 15 INF) might just about do it.

Fantastic! Thank you!

Jen

[wolf90]

Seeing as this is about to close, I tried this one out today instead of #11.

I initially used GP's suggested force of Defense: 8AU (all GEVs) and 18INF, set up all units behind the line. But as described, any breach in the screen and some Defending GEVs could get behind the screen and wreck havoc on the GEV-PCs carrying the Engineers. It's just too hard to break through.

I then tried the suggested 6 AU and 15 INF (again, all GEVs) and the Attackers won but it was three GEV-PC and only 2 Engineers that survived. Once the line is breached, it's a running gun battle. The Infantry is quickly left behind.

I haven't tried the Defense with non-GEVs, just because I feel the mobility will be necessary once the line is breached. That being said, it IS worth trying, as having the punch of HVYs might decimate the Attacker so much that there is no need to chase down units!

My 2 cents…!

D.

[wolf90]

Got in a quick and dirty version using 4 HVYs and 4 Light Tanks in place of the GEVs (using 6 AU and 15 INF for the Defense). The initial contact was devasting to the attackers (although in retrospect, I wouldn't have committed them as aggressively as I did initially, which might have helped).

However, the ability to drop the river bridges allowed me to split the Defense forces, which ended up as the difference in the game. 2 GEV-PCs each with an engineer and 2 squads of infantry made it off the board.

So 6 AU and 15 INF has resulted in Attacker victories both times, but barely so. Maybe 6 AU and 16 Inf? We're definitely in the right area. This is with the defense all lining up on/behind the designated line too…

D.

[wolf90]

Tried 2 HWTZ with 3 Lt Tanks and one LGEV (to drop the bridge @ hex 0708 on S1-N on the first turn) and another run with 3 HTWZ (more spread out - hex 0418 on G1-S, & hexes 0904 plus 1905 both on S1-N). One win for each. I do think 16 Inf are better balanced the 15.

Fun scenario!

D.