05-29-2011, 03:29 AM | #11 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: United Kingdom of Great Britain and some other bits.
|
Re: Hyena
Quote:
A quick search of the web shows some estimates of human bite force in the thousands of psi. If there was a simple conversion of pressure to damage, human bites might do more than bears. Not saying that they shouldn't have Striking ST (Bite only), just that assuming a hyena bite does more damage than a bear bite because they can generate more psi could lead to some false conclusions. |
|
05-29-2011, 08:47 AM | #12 |
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Not in your time zone:D
|
Re: Hyena
Lifting ST (biting only)? Once it's got you in its jaws you're doomed (MA115)
__________________
"Sanity is a bourgeois meme." Exegeek PS sorry I'm a Parthian shootist: shiftwork + out of country = not here when you are:/ It's all in the reflexes |
05-29-2011, 10:29 AM | #13 | |
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
|
Re: Hyena
Quote:
Because I did, right in that same post where I'm guessing at the striking ST. The bite force is suggestive, but I dispute that their actual mechanical ability to shatter and grind up bones better (not on paper, but by giving them bones) isn't relevant. That's actual application of force in a destructive manner that's clearly applicable to bite damage in GURPS. I did NOT assume they should have more ST because of the PSI, I assumed they should have more ST because they do more destructive things. As far as neck and shoulder strength - Spotted hyenas are heavily optimized for this. Their back ends look pretty standard for a hyena, but their front ends look like they've been spending all day working out with weights in prison or something. It's why they look so dang weird. Their teeth are very strongly and deeply rooted, which is needed to support twisting and shaking, not straight crushing. Their bonestructure in their heads is very solid both to endure the forces and as a solid anchor point for the muscles. The neck and shoulder muscles are massively over developed in order to twist and wrench the head with as much power as possible considering the scale of the animal. Total body weight is not part of bite damage unless you're small enough relative to your target that you can actually fling yourself around without the target being flung along with you. Small dogs vs human sized targets, yes (having had a Jack Russel Terrier hanging from my sleeve on more than one occasion), grizzley bears no. It's a tactic that requires smaller animals, because it needs a very high strength to weight ratio to not damage the jaw, teeth, neck muscles, and spine. Bears just can't do that - they've got small heads relative to their very large bodies. I don't think hyenas can significantly use that tactic either, even with their disproportionately developed heads and necks.
__________________
All about Size Modifier; Unified Hit Location Table A Wiki for my F2F Group A neglected GURPS blog |
|
05-29-2011, 06:34 PM | #14 | |
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: The plutonium rich regions of Washington State
|
Re: Hyena
Quote:
If the hyena has the leisure to sit down and bring its carnassals to bear, then it might get an armor divisor of (2) or something, but this might be at a -5 to hit in combat. As an aside, all placental big game hunters have roughly equivalent relative bite strength at the fangs. All placental small game hunters likewise have more or less equivalent bite force at the fangs, but this is weaker for small game hunters than for big game hunters. Bears fare unusually poorly as far as relative bite force - perhaps this is because they do not spend a lot of time eating meat, and perhaps it is because they rely more on their incredible arm strength. Marsupial predators tend to have greater relative bite strength than their equivalent placental analogues. This may be because jaw closing muscles and brains occupy about the same part of the head and they compete for space - marsupials go for more brawn, less brain. Luke |
|
06-01-2011, 04:30 AM | #15 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: United Kingdom of Great Britain and some other bits.
|
Re: Hyena
Quote:
Although I have issues with Weak Bite: with -2 damage per die, it's possible for more ST to result in less damage (although the bonus damage from Brawling helps to balance it out again). Something like using 2/3 of your usual ST to calculate bite damage would have probably worked better. Or I guess you could have a 'somewhat weak bite' Quirk which gave them -1 damage per die. |
|
06-01-2011, 04:38 AM | #16 | |
Join Date: May 2009
|
Re: Hyena
Quote:
|
|
06-01-2011, 05:47 AM | #17 | ||
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: MI
|
Re: Hyena
Quote:
__________________
"My Dirty Girls on Bikes Calendar ends in December: it doesn't mean the world is going to end, it means it's time to order a new calendar!" ~Burt Chance |
||
06-01-2011, 08:01 AM | #18 | |
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: The plutonium rich regions of Washington State
|
Re: Hyena
In my writeups (shortly after GURPS 4 came out, so missing many of the nifty goodness like Born Biter and so on), bears do not have any particular disadvantage for biting compared to people, and do have Sharp Teeth. Their ST is fairly typical for their size, but they get plenty of extra Arm ST (and Blunt Claws).
http://panoptesv.com/RPGs/animalia/m...dae/Bears.html Big game hunters, however, have extra Jaw ST (the equivalent of Arm ST, but for jaws) to allow them to bite harder and hold on with their teeth better. http://panoptesv.com/RPGs/animalia/m...dae/canid.html Quote:
Luke |
|
06-01-2011, 09:03 AM | #19 |
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
|
Re: Hyena
Yeeeees? To the tune of at least 20 pounds, more for hyenas from larger sub-species/ethnic groups/whatever the term is. That's why they get more ST, and that's why the high end of the weight is for females.
Female spotted hyenas also anatomically highly masculinized by all the testosterone that makes them big and aggressive*. It's pretty convincing, to the point where early European naturalists hypothesized that they were an all-male species, or that they changed sexes, or that they were some sort of hybrid. Probably why hyenas got nominated as one of the parents of the leurocotta - lions for ferocity, hyenas for weirdness. * Not entirely due to the testosterone though - they've tested by suppressing testosterone production in pregnant females, and the female cubs were much less "endowed" but still unusual. So there's a genetic factor at work as well as an environmental one.
__________________
All about Size Modifier; Unified Hit Location Table A Wiki for my F2F Group A neglected GURPS blog |
Tags |
animals |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|