Good examples of Social Regards?

[vicky_molokh]

Greetings, all!

To me Social Regard looks like a fuzzy theoretical Advantage with a too-small set of examples. I mean, who has something so obvious that everybody respect them? Respected for medics and doctors, maybe, but I don't think this is true in the whole world, nor that they qualify for 'obvious'; programmers are even less obvious; diplomats, maybe, but how do I visually distinguish them from other white collars?

Feared for all-time bullies ('gops'), but, again, does it fit the standars of a Regard? I don't think they even have the same easily identifiable subculture outside of CIS (very short hair, sports clothing often combined with leather clothing, constantly chewing pumpkin seeds, certain speech patterns etc.).

And Venerated for the elderly also doesn't work, because they have a Social Stigma in some places instead.

So, what does fit under the definitions of a Social Regard?

Thanks in advance to all who answer!

[Tommi_Kovala]

Surely being a gopnik calls for a meta-trait, not just Social Regard?
The advantage, IME, is great for fleshing out a campaign world where you have groups like holy men, witches, Party members, etc... They may have internal hierarchies, but to society at large, they're just separate and respected (and instantly recognisable). Even if you buy Rank in the Most Sacred Order of the Mummified Toad, you'll still have to pay for Social Regard if you want the public to show deference to it.

[Randover]

There is also another problem of Social Regard...and that is character apparance...If for example a Paladin is elite holy warrior and the order reputation is great that he gains Social Regard from it than he can't get the bonus if he is dressed up like a tief. Ergo, he should be in his uniform. Once he takes his uniform off most people would handle him as normal guy, no matter how much recognition he gained as Paladin.

Basicly social regards for free lance advantures is 0. As Advantures always meens trouble but on the other hand they also mean CASH.

Logicaly it sould be +1 for Social Regards (Adventures) when dressed up like advatures...(e.g. wizard in robe, swordsman with sword - if common, cleric in his respective order clothing)

On the other hand - There is little different between bandits and advantures. And one class of advantures does not get social regard - tiefs. The thing that makes villagers "comfortable" with newcomers is that they know something about them. A person who is dressed likea commoner, armed and on-guard seeds dbout at least. So such "villains" might have Social stigma - something like Second rate citizen.

But there is a problem. The above is correct as far as you measure your setting with your group. You could of course measure your group (as zero) and then set the rest of setting according to it.

The other way suggest that you add Social Regard +1 for "uniform" of peasant, when he is doing what ever peasants do. And my Paladin would be something little more extra so he would have Social Regards +2. (Once he is wearing uniform, other wise he would be stanger at 0)

[Lord Carnifex]

In much of East and Southeast Asia, for much of history, Buddhist monks. You can tell them by orange or black robes, shaved heads, rosaries, and vegetarianism.

In much of Southern Europe, and at times other parts of Europe, Catholic priests, monks and friars. Identify them by black with reversed collars or sackcloth robes, or tonsures.

In the Old Republic, Jedi. Identify them by their hairstyles, robes, and light sabers.

On the Discworld, Assassins. Know them by black clothing, fasionable lateness, and continually appraising glances. Or wizards, with their pointy hats. And witches, also with pointy hats.

On Krynn, mages with their white, red or black robes. Heck, on many worlds, mages who often have some sort of identifying clothing.

On Dune, repsect mentats and bene geserit <sp?>.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Tommi_Kovala

Surely being a gopnik calls for a meta-trait, not just Social Regard?
The advantage, IME, is great for fleshing out a campaign world where you have groups like holy men, witches, Party members, etc... They may have internal hierarchies, but to society at large, they're just separate and respected (and instantly recognisable). Even if you buy Rank in the Most Sacred Order of the Mummified Toad, you'll still have to pay for Social Regard if you want the public to show deference to it.

Whoa, they are an internationally known social group? How did you happen to know about them?

[Sanity]

Originally Posted by Lord Carnifex

In much of East and Southeast Asia, for much of history, Buddhist monks. You can tell them by orange or black robes, shaved heads, rosaries, and vegetarianism.

In much of Southern Europe, and at times other parts of Europe, Catholic priests, monks and friars. Identify them by black with reversed collars or sackcloth robes, or tonsures.

In the Old Republic, Jedi. Identify them by their hairstyles, robes, and light sabers.

On the Discworld, Assassins. Know them by black clothing, fasionable lateness, and continually appraising glances. Or wizards, with their pointy hats. And witches, also with pointy hats.

On Krynn, mages with their white, red or black robes. Heck, on many worlds, mages who often have some sort of identifying clothing.

On Dune, repsect mentats and bene geserit <sp?>.

And now consider - how much of that is done through Status or Rank? Most of it will be Rank.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Lord Carnifex

In much of East and Southeast Asia, for much of history, Buddhist monks. You can tell them by orange or black robes, shaved heads, rosaries, and vegetarianism.

In much of Southern Europe, and at times other parts of Europe, Catholic priests, monks and friars. Identify them by black with reversed collars or sackcloth robes, or tonsures.

In the Old Republic, Jedi. Identify them by their hairstyles, robes, and light sabers.

On the Discworld, Assassins. Know them by black clothing, fasionable lateness, and continually appraising glances. Or wizards, with their pointy hats. And witches, also with pointy hats.

On Krynn, mages with their white, red or black robes. Heck, on many worlds, mages who often have some sort of identifying clothing.

On Dune, repsect mentats and bene geserit <sp?>.

Aside from Dune, I think those things are not as obvious. A regual civilian can dress up as most of them, and you won't notice the difference. I think certain biotech parahuman races might qualify, but they have the same problem as the elderly: in some places, their Regard may turn into a Stigma.

[t@nya]

When I think of Social Regard I most often think of fictional examples. One that comes to mind are the Founders in Deep Space 9, and the reactions of their genetically engineered underlings to them.

[Hai-Etlik]

The difference between Social Regard (Mage) and "I'm wearing mage robes" is that the former lets you back it up and doesn't require acting, fast talk, or savoir faire rolls to maintain the illusion. If someone goes to the mage guild to check, you will be on the list. If you run in to an old acquaintance while putting on your mage act you will not have to worry about hearing, "Hey Bob, what's with the pointy hat?" If you meet a real mage, he will not expose you as a charlatan (And possibly turn you into a frog), but rather greet you as a brother.

[Lord Carnifex]

Originally Posted by Sanity

And now consider - how much of that is done through Status or Rank? Most of it will be Rank.

I disagree. Consider Friar Tuck. He's Status -2 or so (he's a bandit!), and doesn't hold Religious Rank beyond whatever it takes for him to be ordained. Yet the common people are going to give him a certain respect - he's a man of the cloth, and a man of God. And even higher status people are going to treat him with more respect than the other Merry Men for it.

Or Anakin Skywalker. I doubt he starts out at more than Status 0; his mother was a slave. The Jedi don't seem to have much of a rank system beyond Apprentice, Jedi Knight, Jedi Master. It doesn't look like he gains any sort of Status in the Republic until he becomes Palpatine's agent - he's not a Galactic Senator or anything like that. Yet he gets regard from people as one of the defenders of peace and order throughout the galaxy.

And then there's Discworld's Rincwind. He's not even a full wizard to the eyes of Unseen University. And definitely Status 0. But he occasionally gets people to defer to him because he is a wizard (if not a very good one.)

Originally Posted by Molokh

A regual civilian can dress up as most of them, and you won't notice the difference.

Sure. I would call it Disguise. Maintaining the deception for any length of time would be Acting. It's a Temporary Advantage until someone finds you out. But more importantly, the dress and personal style signifiers are usually backed up by behavior. A Priest who doesn't pray, or know Latin, or church rituals, or make himself available to the heirarchy will be found out. A Buddhist monk who doesn't meditate, eats meat, or otherwise doesn't do what a monk ought to be doing (or does something a monk shouldn't) will give himself away. And I suspect that someone masquerading as a Jedi ought to stay a few light years away from any real force users, and has to act like a Jedi all the time, or some very dangerous people are going to be upset.