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Old 01-05-2015, 12:49 PM   #141
Varyon
 
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Default Re: [Low-Tech/High-Tech] Looting and Improvising arms and armour in Victorian London

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Originally Posted by Icelander View Post
Do such proof loads have bullets? I know they reach a peak pressure of x2.5 the expected working pressure, but is there is a projectile in the cartridge?
I'd imagine having a projectile in the cartridge would make it easier to achieve a high peak pressure (as the bullet forms an imperfect seal), thus reducing the amount of powder needed. As the lead for the bullet is probably cheaper than the extra powder needed to make up for it - and unlike the powder the bullet can be reclaimed and recast - I think it would actually be most efficient to indeed use bullets.
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Old 01-05-2015, 02:13 PM   #142
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Default Re: [Low-Tech/High-Tech] Looting and Improvising arms and armour in Victorian London

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Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
I think it would actually be most efficient to indeed use bullets.
It would. Developing full pressure in a chamber that's open to the atmosphere would need large amounts of powder, if it's possible at all. Using a heavier bullet would make it easier to develop the required overpressure, but would be testing something different from the "cartridge accidentally overloaded" condition anyway. I have seen pictures of proof cartridges, and they look very much like normal ones.
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Old 01-05-2015, 02:29 PM   #143
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Default Re: [Low-Tech/High-Tech] Looting and Improvising arms and armour in Victorian London

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Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
I'd imagine having a projectile in the cartridge would make it easier to achieve a high peak pressure (as the bullet forms an imperfect seal), thus reducing the amount of powder needed. As the lead for the bullet is probably cheaper than the extra powder needed to make up for it - and unlike the powder the bullet can be reclaimed and recast - I think it would actually be most efficient to indeed use bullets.
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Originally Posted by johndallman View Post
It would. Developing full pressure in a chamber that's open to the atmosphere would need large amounts of powder, if it's possible at all. Using a heavier bullet would make it easier to develop the required overpressure, but would be testing something different from the "cartridge accidentally overloaded" condition anyway. I have seen pictures of proof cartridges, and they look very much like normal ones.
Some black powder cartridges had fairly limited space remaining for more powder. How did they get the extra powder for x2.5 pressure in there if not by substituting some other seal for the bullet?

I imagined that perhaps a conical hollow-base lead cylinder, much shorter than a typical bullet and thus lighter and less aerodynamic, might be used. The hollow base would expand and provide a tight seal, allowing high pressure, but the resulting projectile would be fit only to flatten against the trap used to proof the barrel and wouldn't make much of a projectile in combat.
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Old 01-05-2015, 02:59 PM   #144
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Default Re: [Low-Tech/High-Tech] Looting and Improvising arms and armour in Victorian London

I would be very surprised if the proof loads did not have bullets, you really need that mass to get the pressure up.
To increase the pressure without increasing the powder charge, one can use more finely ground black powder. this would not be done for regular ammunition as there is a big pressure spike, followed by low pressure as the bullet fires down the barrel.
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Old 01-05-2015, 04:54 PM   #145
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Default Hatcher's Notebook --

from some decades later mentioned the 30-06 proof loads -- definitely had bullets. There would have to be some kind of stopper (read bullet) at the front of the round or else the expanding gases would just blow out the muzzle vs. increasing chamber pressure.
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Old 01-06-2015, 04:58 AM   #146
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Default Proof loads

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Originally Posted by Green-Neck View Post
I would be very surprised if the proof loads did not have bullets, you really need that mass to get the pressure up.
To increase the pressure without increasing the powder charge, one can use more finely ground black powder. this would not be done for regular ammunition as there is a big pressure spike, followed by low pressure as the bullet fires down the barrel.
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Originally Posted by fredtheobviouspseudonym View Post
from some decades later mentioned the 30-06 proof loads -- definitely had bullets. There would have to be some kind of stopper (read bullet) at the front of the round or else the expanding gases would just blow out the muzzle vs. increasing chamber pressure.
My research confirms absolutely that proof loads have bullets, frequently heavy ones.

The game stats for proof rounds used in combat will range from a Dmg bonus for Extra-Powerful ammunition, sometimes with no extra chance of Malf. in the best case, such as in the case of the robust Martini-Henry, to essentially unchanged Dmg (rounds which attain overpressure with finer powder, probably because there is very limited space in the casing) and a greatly worsened Malf. in the worst cases.
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Old 01-07-2015, 05:04 PM   #147
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Default Father MacManus Improvised Holy Battle Harness

In the last session, we made some dice rolls and the player of Father MacManus made some decisions. The end result of which was that he exchanged loot, silver and services in barter for Otto Hirschsohn's materials, time and workshop, as well as Reza Aisenstadt's* time and expertise.

Sundry payments were also made to various male Aisenstadts who gathered up the right pieces of leather, wrought iron, steel and other materials from abandoned shops** or small factories in the neighbourhood. Nearby businesses of relevance, in addition to a lot of draperies, dress shops, milliniers, leatherworkers and butchers' shops, are a tin and slate warehouse, an ironmongery, a farrier's workshop, a cork factory and a furniture factory.

Some workers at the Anderson Brothers, boot and shoemakers, also received shiny barter in exchange for a stout pair of Wellington boots and the work involved in helping the Aisenstadts and Hirschsohn's apprentice boy reinforce them with whalebone and metal inserts, not to mention rivet leggings for the shins to them.

MacManus himself was able to find a conical Sudanese (Egyptian-made) bronze war helmet in Doctor Stanley's town house and while the helmet itself didn't fit him well, the mail which was worn under it is useful. He wears the helmet over his leather helmet and mail in any case, even though it is too small for him, liable to fall off and will most likely only protect from attacks from above.

Father MacManus' final ensemble consists of his headgear, reinforced workman's boots and shin leggings, thick reinforced workman's gloves and a massive torso harness. The harness is made of layered leather with iron plates, chains and bars attached.

To support his armour and carry his gear, MacManus wears a belt, suspenders and attachment points on a canvas rig equivalent to web gear (HT p. 54), with one bandoleer holding 24 12-gauge rounds and a cartridge belt (HT:PG 1 p. 33) holding holsters for a 12-gauge sawed-off shotgun pistol and a S&W .44 Russian, 30 rounds for the revolver on the belt and a small shell bag (TS p. 73) with all 18 10-gauge lion shells MacManus has. Attached to his shoulder harness is a one-point sling (chain) for the 10-gauge shotgun pistol. This load-carrying gear weighs 5 lbs. and counts as Basic equipment to allow Fast-Draw, with the sling giving +1 to Fast-Draw the 10-gauge shotgun and the shell bag giving +1 to Fast-Draw for 10-gauge shells.

First the Father donned a thick leather coat with padding underneath, to which two butcher's aprons are riveted front-and-back. This forms the underlayer, which is used to anchor scavanged metal plates in riveted pockets of canvas or leather. Over this around the upper torso are wrapped several thicknesses of steel chain reinforced with bars, supported by a modified horse-harness over the shoulders.

Protecting the front of the Chest hit location are two quarter-inch thick pieces of wrought iron in improvised canvas pockets riveted to the leather of the butcher's apron in the front. Each piece is around 12" by 18" and side by side, they thus covers a lot of the chest. Below those, for the front of the Abdomen hit location, are three pieces of 5/16-inch iron plate, two around 6" by 6" riveted side-by-side where the breastplate ends (with significant gaps between) and one ca 5" by 3" piece hanging below those. The larger two plates weight 13 lbs. each and the smaller ones weight 6 lbs., 6 lbs. and 3 lbs. The total weight for metal plates is thus 41 lbs.

I've rated the thicker plates as having DR 12 and the thinner ones as having DR 8. The coverage is 4/6 for the front of the Chest and 3/6 for the front of the Abdomen. With a called shot, the coverage may be bypassed with a -3 penalty to hit the unprotected areas of the upper Chest or a -2 penalty to hit unprotected areas of the Abdomen above the normal hit location penalty (translates into -3 in total to hit the unprotected Abdomen or -5 to hit unprotected individual hit locations that are part of it, such as Groin). Attackers in a side hex subtract 2 from those penalties.

The chains and bars over the upper torso I've elected to call Cheap, Butted combined mail (uses Mail and Plates stats), with the bars serving a similar function as small plates, i.e. increasing DR against crushing damage at the cost of increased weight. This means that this part of the panoply adds DR 4 (cut) /DR 3 (cr) / DR 2 (imp) to the Chest hit location and adds 15 lbs.

The leather coat, padding and aprons combine to serve as Medium Leather for the Torso and Arms, as well as giving 1/6 protection to the legs (upper thighs) and having a 4/6 chance of giving protection to another 1/6 of the leg (lower thighs) if attacked from the front or rear hexes. Attacks from the side hexes have only a 2/6 chance of hitting the apron. The protection on the thighs can be bypassed with a called shot at an -3 above what the hit location would normally require (translates into -6 to hit the unprotected part of the leg, -8 to hit the unprotected leg vein/artery). Attackers in a side hex subtract 2 from these penalties.

As a special effect, the sides of the torso, upper arms, elbows, upper thighs and lower thighs are only DR 1*, as these are only protected by the coat or a hanging apron, not padding and two riveted layers of leather. The rest of the torso is DR 2* (most threats) / DR 1* (imp). The shoulders have chains and harness fastenings that count as Jack Chains reinforcing, for a +1 DR against cut. The coat, padding and aprons weight 32 lbs., included are the various pockets and fastenings for the other pieces of armour.

Father MacManus' functional head protection consists of DR 2 Leather Helmet covering the Skull and weighing 1 lbs.; and a DR 3/1 light mail coif covering the Skull, back of the Head and Neck weighing 3.6 lbs. A DR 4 bronze conical helmet weighing 5 lbs. may provide protection against swinging attacks on the Skull on a 3/6 and other attacks on a 2/6; attacks from above add +2 to chance of protection. Total weight of head protection is 9.6 lbs.

Leather work gloves that are reinforced on the outer part are treated as open-palmed gauntlets made from Medium Leather reinforced with Jack Chains, protecting the Hands and Forearms. They have DR 3 (cut) / DR 2 (other) / DR 1 (imp) and weigh 5.2 lbs. The metal studdings also count as brass knuckles, giving +1 to punch damage.

The Wellington boots are reinforced with Jack Chains and weight 5 lbs. They grant DR 2 for most attacks and DR 3 (cut). They also grant +1 kicking damage. The leggings that cover the Shins are Medium Leather reinforced with Jack Chains, weighing 7.5 lbs. and giving DR 3 (cut) / DR 2 (other) / DR 1 (imp). They extend up to the knee and the knee itself is wrapped in multiple layers of cloth, with padding and small pieces of metal reinforcing in front. This counts as Bezainting reinforced Cheap Layered Cloth, for DR 2* (cut) / DR 1* (other) and weighing 0.8 lbs. The armour gap at the back of the knee is unprotected and may be targeted with a called shot at -7 for those in front and at -5 for those to the sides or rear.

The forearms are furthermore protected by layers of chain and barstock, treated as Butted, Cheap combined mail (Mail and Plate stats). This adds DR 4 for all attacks except cr and imp (DR 3/2), for a further 6.25 lbs. The shins have the same chain and barstock as the forearms, giving DR 4 for all attacks except cr and imp, which receive DR 2. This weighs 12.5 lbs.

Stats for the panoply

Total panoply weight: 137.85 lbs.
Hard of Hearing
Ham-Fisted 2
-1 DX penalty
-1 to Move and a further -1 to athletic feats involving jumps in addition to general DX penalty
MacManus is at Medium encumbrance while wearing the panoply and carrying his other combat gear.
Total gear carried is ca 230 lbs.

Head: DR 3* (cr) / DR 5* (other)
Skull: DR 3* (cr) / DR 5* (other)
Skull, 2/6 chance of protection: DR 7 cr / DR 9 (other)
Back of Head (hit location 5): DR 1* (cr) / DR 3* (other)
Face: DR 0
Neck: DR 1* (cr) / DR 3* (other)
Torso: DR 1* (imp/pi) / DR 2* (other)
Chest: DR 3 (imp/pi) / DR 5 (other) / DR 6 (cut)
Chest(F), 4/6 coverage: DR 15 (imp/pi) / DR 17 (other) / DR 18 (cut)
Abdomen(F), 3/6 coverage: DR 9 (imp/pi) / DR 10 (other)
Arms: DR 1*
Shoulders: DR 1* (imp/pi) / 2* (other) / 3* (cut)
Upper Arms: DR 1*
Elbows: DR 1*
Forearms: DR 3* (imp/pi) / DR 5* (cr) / DR 6* (other) / DR 7* (cut)
Hands: DR 1* (imp/pi) / 2* (other) / 3* (cut)
Legs: DR 1*
Upper Thighs (1/6 coverage of Leg): DR 1*
Lower Thighs (1/6 coverage of Leg): DR 0
Lower Thighs (hanging apron), 4/6 chance of protection from front or rear: DR 1*
Knees (1/6 coverage of Leg), back of knee unprotected: DR 1* (all) / DR 2* (cut)
Shins (3/6 coverage of Leg): DR 3* (imp/pi) / DR 5* (cr) / DR 6* (other) / DR 7* (cut)
Feet: DR 2 (all) / DR 3 (cut)

Shield
In addition, Father MacManus carries a squarish sheet of half-inch thick iron as a Medium Shield. This weighs 26 lbs. and gives Cover DR 12.

Hirschsohn attached both a chain neck strap (2 lbs.) and leather arm straps (2 lbs.), as well as attaching a saddle holster (1.5 lbs.) for a howdah pistol to the inner face of the metal, so that MacManus can carry his 10-gauge cut-down shotgun there. A convenient shear in the metal provides a place to rest the 12" barrel when MacManus aims the weapon as a pistol from behind the shield. With pistol attached, the shield weighs 37 lbs.

*Not to mention a legion of daughters-in-law and nieces.
**Braving feral rat imps and worse in the process.
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Old 01-08-2015, 10:00 AM   #148
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Default Making ammunition

The PCs and their several hundred allies* have for the past 36 hours had access to two TL5 shotshell presses (HT p. 174).

This is important, because not only did the survivors have few weapons, they also had little ammunition and much of what they had was unsuitable for combat. They have few rifles, muskets or carbines and any revolvers they have lack ammunition.

This makes it vital that the several dozen sporting shotguns that have been seized from raiders or found in dwellings can be turned to a defensive use. Unfortunately, a fowling piece is just not a very good weapon against humans, let alone demonic creatures with high HP, tolerance for pain and bleeding and even occasionally DR 1-2.

What I imagine the PCs and their allies thus need to do is to make new ammunition with larger ball. They need to empty out the tiny pellets from all the shotshells that fire shot too small to have any self-defence applications and replace them with more useful projectiles, preferably buckshot or something even larger like three or five larger round balls or a buck-and-ball load.

Reloading Presses

One of the two reloading presses is a small portable device that can only load 10-gauge brass shells, about as old as a reloading press can be in 1888 and intended for home reloading for a frugal market hunter. This is Isaac Aisenstadt's prized press to reload brass for his periodic geese hunts. He also owns shot moulds for various fowling and geese pellet sizes, along with early TL5 tools for measuring and pouring powder, waxing paper cartridges, etc. He and his younger nephew are both thoroughly familiar with both newer and older methods of reloading their fowling brass and making waxed paper shotgun shells. I guess that Isaac and his nephew would use 5mm-6mm shot at the very largest for geese at long range and thus have moulds and dies up to that size.

The other reloading press is a fancier machine that was made in the 1880s and weighs enough not to be portable. It is meant for 12-gauge shells, but if it is plausible, I wouldn't see anything wrong with it being adjustable for other common fowling shells. It belongs to the redoubtable Otto Hirschsohn, who sells some cheap fowling ammo and reloads brass shotshells for a small fee in his ironmongery.

There are no rifle or pistol cartridge presses anywhere in the neighbourhood and no facilities to cast any bullet shape except round shot. The available dies, furthermore, range from very small birdshot up to larger fowling shot, with nothing larger than perhaps some very long range goose shot.

Availability of Shot or More Effective Projectiles

I've ruled that any shotgun shells looted from houses in the neighbourhood, or the bodies of raiders who got theirs from a shipment of sporting shotguns and ammunition going to a sporting goods store in the City of London, are birdshot or smaller. I can't find any suggestion that buckshot would be used by urban people in London. Even if they occasionally go out of the city to shoot, they would be shooting game birds.

Am I being unfair to the PCs by supposing this and thus ruling that buckshot was unavailable?

I freely admit that I know little about typical blackpowder fowling loads, so I don't have a clear idea of the kind of shells that would be most common among London sportsmen in 1888, but in the absence of evidence or the testimony of a more knowledgable expert on the subject, I suspect that nothing much bigger than 6mm is common enough to be available within the small area that the PCs are. Possibly the largest available are even smaller than that, as what are sold in the ironmongery are meant to be only maybe the three most common loads for shotgun owners in England and what has turned up in homes adds maybe another 6-7 types, but no true rarities.

As an absolute maximum shot size that Hirschonh's press would be set up to handle, I imagine it would likely be the largest useful for any kind of fowling, which seems to be around 6mm, as fairly specialised long-range waterfowl shot. Anything common enough already to exist as cartridges 'in stock' would be smaller than this, ranging from utterly harmless smallshot below 2mm to large-ish birdshot at 4mm or so.

If people in London who owned a shotgun in 1888 used buckshot for anything, however, I would be willing to consider the possibility of Hirschsohn owning some dies that could be used to make them, 'just in case'. So far, however, I have found nothing that suggests that anyone other than people living in Scotland or the colonies would be at all likely to ever see larger shot than birdshot in their lives.

From what I can tell, the English shot fowl with shotguns and other game that is found within England, if at all, with rook and rabbit rifles or with deer rifles.

Stats for Large Waterfowl Shot and Real-World Stacking Considerations for Blackpowder Shells

It looks like large waterfowl shot consisting of close to 6mm pellets might, at best, stack maybe 21-23 pellets to a 12-gauge shell and 30 pellets to a 10-gauge shell. Maybe even that is optimistic for a black powder British shell of 2.5" for the 12-gauge and 2 7/8" 10-gauge and more reasonable loads would be limited to 17 or so 6mm pellets in a 12-gauge and 24 or so for the 10-gauge. That would be a light load in terms of weight of shot, but maybe the stacking doesn't allow for more in a black powder shotgun cartridge. I don't have a very good feel for how much of a British 2.5" long 12-gauge shell is taken up with black powder and fiber wads and I have essentially no sense of how to stack in a 10-gauge.

From what I can gather, very large waterfowl shot will do 1d(0.5) pi- at the very best, out to Range 30/600 at the most. Many loads will be 1d-1(0.5) pi- and/or Range 25/500. This is hardly effective as demon-slaying combat/self-defence ammo, especially not against critters with DR 1*. Even if I allow a heavy 10-gauge load that edges 1d+1(0.5) pi- with 24-27 or so pellets, it would be only barely effective against anything larger than a mutated poodle or a feral hellrat.

At extremely short ranges, up to maybe 5' to 9' feet, birdshot loads act as makeshift slugs under GURPS rules, doing 4d(0.25) pi++ for a very low power 12-gauge load to 6d(0.25) pi++ for high-power 10-gauge loads, but the survivors have to be able to shoot at more than 10' distance in many cases. GURPS rules for chokes would extend the makeshift slug range to 15' or even 18' for the largest shot, but that's still very much reduced practical engagement range than what anyone would wish.

Tactical Requirements for the Survivors who Use Shotguns

While long ranged shooting may not be called for in the defence of the small area of the East End claimed by the survivors, it would be nice to have a combat load that could do more than annoy a human-sized target at 30 yards or so. Some of the best shooting positions in the church and around it allow shots down the surrounding streets for up to fifty yards or even more if attackers come straight down the High Street, but most survivors who can get shotguns aren't going to be more than skill 8-11.

It is therefore not likely that they are going to be making many of those long shots, so effectiveness at up to 30 yards is all that is absolutely required for most of those who carry shotguns. For the best shotgun shots among them, a good heavy buckshot load (000+ buck in modern terms, LG or lion shot in period terms), buck-and-ball or another method of making a shotgun viable at 40+ yards would be very nice, but not absolutely critical.

The foraging teams who move into monster-held territory often encouter feral small animals that are vicious and extremely dangerous because of some unnatural force of vitality and power. For them, it is without a doubt vital to have effective combat loads at 7-10 yards, which even large waterfowl shot aren't under GURPS rules against anything but very thin-skinned targets. Anything DR 1* will laugh at them and even a DR 0 HP 5 demonic fowl, that attacks in a berserking rage all but heedless of any wounds short of death, will on average not be stopped by a hit by 5 or so pellets, which is all that a decent shot can expect given the way GURPS treats Rapid Fire.

Bullet Moulds Available to the Survivors

A search by survivors has turned up several sets of older bullet moulds in addition to the more modern reloading presses and the dies that came with them, but again, the older bullet moulds are usually for shot, with the largest being similar to the largest dies available, as above.

Only bullet mould that has been found is for a larger round ball and that is a .50 inch one that came with an antique pistol. This is far too big to substitute for buckshot and you could barely get two of them in a 12-gauge shell.

How difficult is it to improvise a mould for larger spherical balls from what you would find around, say, an ironmongery?

Is there anything likely to be lying around that would do perfectly for making round shot between .33 inch and .38 inch in diameter?

How about bullets? Is there something available in a 1888 ironmongery that you could use for moulds to make conical bullets/slugs or at least full-bore round balls for a 10-gauge, 12-gauge and 16-gauge shotguns?

Is there something you could use to make the kind of bullets that will fit in hand-reloaded brass for pistols of .32 caliber, .38 caliber and the various rounds close to .45 caliber?

*Also known as the civilian populace that needs protecting.
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Old 01-09-2015, 08:48 AM   #149
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Default Isaac Aisenstadt's improvised musket loads for his shotgun

Isaac Aisenstadt owns a twenty-year-old 10-gauge double fowling gun made in Belgium* by Pirlot Frères, Liège that has seen heavy use, but is very well-maintained. It had 32" barrels, but once he got time during the recent unpleasantness, Isaac cut down the barrels to 22" length and improvised new sights in cooperation with his friend Otto Hirscsohn.

Isaac had been using heavy waterfowl shot in his gun to defend his large clan, their business and eventually, his neighbours. Once their immediate security was secured, he'd have wanted better monster-killin ammunition. His first attempt, ordered from his nephew while Isaac was still rescuing neighbours from their shops and creating a defensive parameter larger than their own home, was extremely improvised.

The first batch were made by cutting the front end off a waxed paper shell, removing the birdshot and adding a sixpence and a layer of wet linen to the wadding. The pellets are then mixed wax melted in a pot at the home stove, before using a spoon to reload the shell with a mixture of wax and birdshot.

A later, more involved process consisted of ordering the powder removed from a brass shell and the preparation of a waxed paper shell that could fit inside it. The waxed paper shell was then lined with canvas, wet linen pads or anything else not very flammable, a six-pence piece was inserted in place of a wad and bottom two-thirds filled with cork or something else not flammable. Once this was done, the top third of it was filled up with small shot useless for combat purposes and the entire shell held over a fire to heat the top third enough to melt the shot together into one 19x25mm slug-like object.

Remove slug, replace anything damaged by the heat and repeat. The slug is then wrapped in paper and used to make a slug load for the 10-gauge in a fresh brass casing.

Fortunately, Isaac had some faster-burning powder that his nephew uses for his little 16-gauge walkabout piece and can therefore load 4 1/2 dram of that behind the latter batch of makeshift slugs. Faster-burning powder is vital to prevent velocity loss from the 22" barrels, as his usual long-range waterfowl loads make use of slower burning powder optimised for 32" barrels.

The first batch were 19.5x25mm slugs that weigh around 350 grains. The latter batch were closer to 19x25mm slugs that weigh around 650 grains.

The wax slugs are fairly regularly shaped, but lose their shape quickly in flight. The Range is halved from what 19.5mm round ball would get. The wax slugs have normal Acc for the shotgun at short ranges, but after Range 50, any futher increase in Range penalty is doubled, so at 70 yards the penalty goes to -9 (instead of -8 for normal rounds) and at 100 yards it goes to -12 (instead of -10 for normal rounds) and so on. They are very frangible, with DR counting triple against them (AD 0.33).

The second batch of slugs are heavier and thus more dangerous to tough creatures, but they are irregularly shaped and prone to deforming and breaking up on impact. They have reduced Range than 19mm round balls would get, but better than the wax slugs. They also cause -1 to Acc at all ranges and are treated as frangible (AD 0.5). These are Extra-Powerful loads and the kick, explosive roar, gout of flame from the barrel and the smoke are all frightful. Add +1 to any Per checks made to locate the firer.

The third batch manage to squeese 3 paper-wrapped .50 inch round balls into a 10-gauge casing, though not without reducing the powder load from the heavy slug loads. Because of problems with stacking, the weight of shot is actually fairly modest for a 10-gauge and the round kicks less than the second batch of improvised slugs.

Pirlot Frères, Liège 10-gauge Double Fowling Gun
--- Shooting Wax Slugs, First Batch (from 32" barrel)
TL 6; Dmg 4d(0.33) pi++; Acc 3; Range 50/1,000; Weight 9.4/0.18 lbs.; RoF 2 x 1; Shots 2(3i); ST 12†; Bulk -6; Rcl 6; Cost $300; Notes [1,2]

--- Shooting Improvised Slugs, Second Batch (from 22" barrel)
TL 6; Dmg 6d(0.5) pi++; Acc 2; Range 70/1,400; Weight 8.2/0.24; RoF 2 x 1; Shots 2(3i); ST 13†; Bulk -5; Rcl 7; Cost $350; Notes [2]

--- Shooting Multi-Ball, Third Batch (from 22" barrel)
TL 6; Dmg 3d+2 pi+; Acc 3; Range 60/650; Weight 8.2/0.22; RoF 2 x 3; Shots 2(3i); ST 12†; Bulk -5; Rcl 1/7; Cost $350

[1] Add -1 to the accumulating penalty for every increment of range after 50 yards, so that 70 yards gives a -9, 100 yards -12, 150 yards -14, etc.
[2] Using my houserules for damage type, these would be SM 2; pi+++, I think.


*Bought used sixteen years ago.
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Old 01-10-2015, 09:59 AM   #150
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Default More on Shotguns

Of course, the first thing that the PCs did upon seeing Isaac shoot his old Belgian double in the depths of Aldgate Station was decide to give him a Winchester Model 1887 10-gauge lever shotgun.

That venerable firearm was not safe to use with smokeless powder. How would it handle a black powder load that counts as Extra-Powerful due to heavy load of shot and powder? Note, the load does not exceed historical black powder charges, but it is at the very limit of them.

Could the Winchester lever-action shotgun handle the heaviest shot charges of the day, until smokeless powder? Or was it less capable than a double or single-shot weapon of varying the charge and very much prefered a diet of monotonous regularity, of one particular load with no significant variations in shotload pressure?

How common were 2 5/8 inch ('American') 12-gauge guns as fowling guns in England?

What about other shell lengths for 12-gauge shotguns? Were there 2.75" shotguns made before modern star crimps? Did anyone own a gun with space for 3-inch shells which he intended for sporting use at home in England and not for use in the bush where he might have to shoot a lion?

Were almost all 12-gauge English sporting guns chambered for 2 1/2-inch long shells or was it not particularly remarkable to find guns with longer chambers?

Can single-shot or double shotguns designed for 3" shells use shorter shells without penalty? GURPS High-Tech and Adventure Guns state that they'll chamber and fire the shells, but in real world terms, is this less effective somehow?

For example, does this mean that a tight seal isn't present and some of the gasses escape out the breech, thus costing velocity (not to mention possibly burning the shooter or at least blinding him)?

Does it play havoc with grouping, penalising Acc or at least reducing the Rapid Fire bonus?

Does it not matter with shot, but may reduce Acc with 'pumpkin' round balls or other types of slugs?
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Last edited by Icelander; 01-10-2015 at 05:59 PM.
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improvised armor, low-tech, victorian


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