Recreating the Miracles... (Touchy subject)

[naraht]

Working with the idea of an Elohite of Faith fallen to Factions led to some interesting questions about creating Jesus's miracles in campaign.

Loaves and Fishes should be able to be done with a Corporeal Song of Succor, right?
Walking on Water, Corporeal Motion???

Most of the healing could be done with Songs of Healing of some type, but of course Larazus causes some questions (risen as undead?)

Resurrection. What is the easiest way IN to appear to be dead (is there a way in IN to go celestial, but leave the vessel?) temporarily.

[Dalillama]

Originally Posted by naraht

Working with the idea of an Elohite of Faith fallen to Factions led to some interesting questions about creating Jesus's miracles in campaign.

Loaves and Fishes should be able to be done with a Corporeal Song of Succor, right?
Walking on Water, Corporeal Motion???

Most of the healing could be done with Songs of Healing of some type, but of course Larazus causes some questions (risen as undead?)

Resurrection. What is the easiest way IN to appear to be dead (is there a way in IN to go celestial, but leave the vessel?) temporarily.

I'd call Loaves and Fishes Abracadabra, personally. An alternate option for walking on water would be a hypothetial Attunement from Oannes. As far as Lazarus goes, the Ressurection Shroud (LR, p 90 is the only canonical means of bringing someone back to life. IIRC, Lazarus had been dead for some time before being brought back, so the only kind of Undead you could pull off would be a Zombie. There's no way to go Celestial and leave the body other than a Body Bag, but a Heartless Celestial could probably find some way to get enough Essence together to die, go to Limbo, and come back with a new Vessel. Alternately, Trauma can be as short as three days, it's quite possible to have the Vessel actually die, and then come back with a new one, although neither of these would get rid of the old body, so you don't get an empty tomb. An easier way is to assume that a Vessel's greater vitality allowed for surviving the crucifixion, stabbing, etc, and the body was taken down earler than is customary. The Vessel, unconcious or faking it, is put in the tomb, then the Celestial takes on Celestial form, goes away, waits three days either on the Celestial Plane, in a different Vessel, or out of sight in the same one, then comes back after three days while everyone's wondering where the body went.

[William]

Another possibility is that Lazarus was revived as a Saint, with his body being used as the raw material for his Vessel.

However, if it was a straight resurrection, then this is beyond known Songs and relics, as one would expect of a real Messiah.

[Jason]

Originally Posted by DAlillama

There's no way to go Celestial and leave the body other than a Body Bag, but a Heartless Celestial could probably find some way to get enough Essence together to die, go to Limbo, and come back with a new Vessel. Alternately, Trauma can be as short as three days, it's quite possible to have the Vessel actually die, and then come back with a new one, although neither of these would get rid of the old body, so you don't get an empty tomb. An easier way is to assume that a Vessel's greater vitality allowed for surviving the crucifixion, stabbing, etc, and the body was taken down earler than is customary. The Vessel, unconcious or faking it, is put in the tomb, then the Celestial takes on Celestial form, goes away, waits three days either on the Celestial Plane, in a different Vessel, or out of sight in the same one, then comes back after three days while everyone's wondering where the body went.

If you could somehow fake that the vessel was dead, and not actually have it be dead, then you could spend three days in the Marches, and then the vessel would disappear entirely upon heading back to the celestial realm. Then you could show up on Earth with a new vessel made to look just like the disappeared one. (I suspect, however, that if you went to "sleep" in time for the vessel to get killed, then went to the celestial realm from the Marches, the dead vessel would stay in place, rather than disappearing; it's basically severed from you when killed, right?)

[Phoenix42]

On a side note: maybe that's the reason why the biblical resurrections always take 3 days (Jesus, Lazarus...); to prove to celestials that this is not just some random zombie-raiser stealing the show, but a powerful Intervention, capable of raising somebody wholesale. I mean, what other reason would there be (cough, Isis-also-took-three-days-to-revive-Osiris-if-I'm not mistaken, cough)? :)

I'll be back to post more - hopefully more useful - stuff later on, just occurred to me.

[Dalillama]

Originally Posted by Phoenix42

On a side note: maybe that's the reason why the biblical resurrections always take 3 days (Jesus, Lazarus...); to prove to celestials that this is not just some random zombie-raiser stealing the show, but a powerful Intervention, capable of raising somebody wholesale. I mean, what other reason would there be (cough, Isis-also-took-three-days-to-revive-Osiris-if-I'm not mistaken, cough)? :)

I'll be back to post more - hopefully more useful - stuff later on, just occurred to me.

The Ressurection Shroud in LR specifically takes three days to work and 100 years to charge, wo that could account for one of them eaasily.