Talk of TFT

[GlennDoren]

Originally Posted by Dave Crowell

In point of reality many of us don't "already have it" when it comes to the originals and no one else can "get it". They have been out of print for decades.

The current Car Wars mini game in a box slightly larger than the original would I think be a great format to get TFT back on game store shelves. It is a small, relatively inexpensive game. That is what Melee and Wizard should be. Nothing wrong with stabled, black and white rule booklets. The Melee and Wizard rules are really too short for any other presentation to make sense.

I would like to see full colour painted counters instead of the original single colour ones though.

Very true--the "new users" won't have original copies or PDFs. With that said--if we go the "inexpensive"/barebones route, i would hope for a nice Deluxe version as well for those of us looking for high quality counters (I am also not a fan of stand-up cardboard heroes or unpainted minis), perhaps nicely mounted mapboards. Yes, a simple B/W rulebook works... again, as long as there's an optional Deluxe version which is nicely bound and has all of the rules integrated into one complete version (as opposed to a Melee booklet, a Wizard booklet, etc.).

And I say this knowing I'll ultimately want/use a PDF version of the rules on my iPad for quick reference.

BUT... if nothing else... I definitely think the time should be taken to update/improve the rules, as opposed to just doing some simple edits and spitting out a v1 reprint.

[Rick_Smith]

Originally Posted by GlennDoren

Very true--the "new users" won't have original copies or PDFs. With that said--if we go the "inexpensive"/barebones route, i would hope for a nice Deluxe version as well for those of us looking for high quality counters (I am also not a fan of stand-up cardboard heroes or unpainted minis), perhaps nicely mounted mapboards. Yes, a simple B/W rulebook works... again, as long as there's an optional Deluxe version which is nicely bound and has all of the rules integrated into one complete version (as opposed to a Melee booklet, a Wizard booklet, etc.).

Hi Everyone, Glenn.
Glenn, I agree with virtually everything you said above. I thought I was the only person who preferred counters to cardboard heroes. I'm glad a bunch of people have weighted in on this.

I think SJG needs to watch how many variations of TFT they have in inventory. (Texas taxes businesses for unsold stock in inventory - amazing). I can see TFT becoming at MOST:

-- Some sort of kickstarter special.
-- The normal TFT that SJG will carry for a long time / forever. May or may not be the same as the kickstarter above.
-- Some adventures, e.g. Death Test 1 & 2, Tollenkar's lair.
-- New adventures?

I could see a fair number of TFT products appearing as *.pdf only products on W23 as well.

But my point is that likely there will be as few SKU (stock counting units) as they can get away with. I doubt that there will be the counter only version, the miniature version. MAYBE kickstarter will allow people to buy into extra fancy versions (people contract to pay in advance after all so SJG knows that they can sell all the extra nice versions that they manufacture).

Originally Posted by GlennDoren

And I say this knowing I'll ultimately want/use a PDF version of the rules on my iPad for quick reference.

Having the rules as a *.pdf for my iPad is a cool idea. Sadly I would likely have to pay twice for this.

Originally Posted by GlennDoren

BUT... if nothing else... I definitely think the time should be taken to update/improve the rules, as opposed to just doing some simple edits and spitting out a v1 reprint.

I totally agree.

Warm regards, Rick.

[Steve Jackson]

Problem here is, everyone wants to see some sort of update, and everyone has a different idea about what should be updated! My goal for the first new sets is to make it what it should have been originally, which is not necessarily the game I would design from scratch right now.

[GlennDoren]

Originally Posted by Steve Jackson

Problem here is, everyone wants to see some sort of update, and everyone has a different idea about what should be updated! My goal for the first new sets is to make it what it should have been originally, which is not necessarily the game I would design from scratch right now.

I totally understand the tug-of-war you're stuck in with this. I hope "the first new sets" implies a v2 is a real possibility. I'm also curious what a "new TFT" would be, if you were designing from scratch now. Would it be so different that it would simply be a brand new system? Or is it something still recognizable as an improved TFT?

I realize you may not have a clear answer to this yet... or one you're looking to fully discuss at this point.

[Dave Crowell]

I am excited by the thought of TFT as it should have been. I haven't played since the '80s and my copies are long lost to the dusts of time. I remember the game fondly and would love to be able to introduce it to some of my current gaming crew who have never played it, or even heard of it.

A new TFT "as Steve would design it from scratch today" implies considerable design time and energy. Time and energy that may or may not be available for designing a "new" TFT. I hope that the reprint of TFT does well enough to justify work on a new and expanded TFT for the future.

[GlennDoren]

Agreed re: the reality of a v2 time/development cost, and needing to see how a cleaned up v1 does in the marketplace. If the initial releases represent a "v1 done right", in Steve's eyes, and includes quality components (nicely done rules layout, cleaned up editing and clarifications, quality counters) in a solid box... cool.

PDF option would be a high priority, in my book. If not official, I (and many others) would likely make their own PDF anyway. So why not make an official clean version.

And an app that can run solo/co-op adventures (with AI) would also be a major selling point. Of course, that's something that could clearly be done after the initial releases prove the market. FRankly, this type of feature would likely expand the market for the game.

I'm looking forward to the initial releases with some supplements/solo quests to (hopefully) follow.

[DouglasCole]

Originally Posted by GlennDoren

PDF option would be a high priority, in my book. If not official, I (and many others) would likely make their own PDF anyway. So why not make an official clean version.

[Pedant Alert!]

All modern games start life as a PDF anyway, since printers mostly take PDF files as their masters. So doing this once you have a publishable, printable file is trivial. Export at 150 dpi and you can be done.

Do you mean an eBook in MOBI or ePUB? Those are auto-reformatting, etc, in a way that a PDF isn't.

[/Pendantic]

[GlennDoren]

Originally Posted by DouglasCole

[Pedant Alert!]

Do you mean an eBook in MOBI or ePUB? Those are auto-reformatting, etc, in a way that a PDF isn't.

[/Pendantic]

Main point was to have an official PDF release... I realize the work involved would be minimal. Some companies choose to not release a PDF simply because they don't want an easily pirated clean copy (e.g. Kingdom Death: Monster). Seeing that SJG has fully embraced digital releases, I'm sure it's not an issue.

Having a copy with hyperlinks would be great (for table of contents and index with links). An ePUB version would be cool.

[JLV]

Certainly I plan to buy any PDFs that Steve makes -- even though I already have OCR copies of everything ever produced for TFT. Not only do I want to make sure I have top-quality electronic versions (just in case the house burns down), but also because I want to support the designer of the game, even though I don't generally use electronic versions for play.

[Jim Kane]

Originally Posted by JLV

Certainly I plan to buy any PDFs that Steve makes -- even though I already have OCR copies of everything ever produced for TFT. Not only do I want to make sure I have top-quality electronic versions (just in case the house burns down), but also because I want to support the designer of the game, even though I don't generally use electronic versions for play.

I am right with you on what you said JLV, and for all the reasons you cited.

JK