Something much better than high school

[Langy]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

Computer operation is an obsolete skill by TL 10. Computers capable of intelligently parsing language make it pointless.

This is completely untrue. There are quite a few things I'd still want to do through other means than a natural-language interface, even at TL10. Keyboards, mice, and other interface devices will not become obsolete once natural language processing is possible, and neither will operating systems, various operating system settings, and programs like Photoshop, Microsoft Word, etc.

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by jacobmuller

A vote against raising IQ.
Differently educated would mean differently able but better able to do Anything seems unreasonable.

TL8 military training is able to raise IQ for special operators, according to HANS and Kromm. One of the ways to represent a good general education in GURPS is to raise IQ.

Why would it be unreasonable if having a solid grounding in a wide variety of academic skills would improve your defaults with others and at the rate at which you gain new ones, the game effect of higher IQ? It seems to me that this game effect models the observed effects of high-quality education that teaches research, independent analysis of sources, critical thinking and the construction of reasoned arguments.

Militaries that have to teach people to perform a wide range of previously unknown tasks under pressure in a short period of time vastly prefer people with a broad education. This is not necessarily because their civilian education will have included skill in rewiring vehicles or calling in airstrikes, but because they have learned how to learn. It takes a shorter time to train a college-educated person to be a special operator than it takes to train someone with the same level of native intelligence, but without the same education. Obviously, individuals differ greatly and anecdotal evidence can be found in any direction, but this effect is nevertheless real and measurable. The differences are startling and amount to a +1 to +2 IQ in GURPS terms.

Originally Posted by jacobmuller

How about an increased rate of gain of skills. Instead of 15cp of background skills, they get 20cp?

This would be a natural consequence of having better schooling, yes, in addition to a higher IQ as noted above. But what skills? At what rate?

Obviously, this would depend on the student, to a great deal. But some basics would be standard parts of the curriculum, with others as electives or advanced courses.

I would suggest using the Dabbler Perk to represent fields of minor study, like a one semester elective in Greek drama, and full points in skills that the character has devoted multiple semesters to.

Computer Operations, Research and Writing seem like obvious skills to teach anyone preparing for a college-level education.

Anyone with an interest in science would learn more math than suggested by a default, but I'll confess enough lack of interest in the subject myself so that I don't know whether it is common to teach Maths (Pure) to anyone but mathematicians and computer scientists. Perhaps Maths (Applied) would be what most people learned. Or not. Maths (Computer Science) and Maths (Statistics) also seem likely to be required for further study of many viable career paths.

Dabbler or a full point in some field of Physics seems like a fairly solid bet at TL10 and Astronomy as well. That's for a spacefaring culture, of course. The value of these skills will depend heavily on how much of the planet's econmy takes place in space. If working on a spaceliner or space station is a viable career path, they will be common. If not, well, they are not exactly commonplace with average people today. Geology (planetology) might also have applications for a space-traveller, but much more so if the setting has FTL travel. Chemistry, of course, would be learned at Dabbler level for anyone contemplating many science careers.

Expert Skill (Computer Security) is an obvious choice for anyone with an interest in working with computers, as is Computer Programming. The whole range of Electronic Operations and Repair skills would also be offered as electives for technically minded students who plan to enter tech-heavy fields. Mathematics (Cryptology) might also see use and Cryptography, depending on how much computer security and countermeasures are an intergral part of high-tech careers.

Life sciences like Biology and its engineering cousin, Bioengineering, could be vital in bio-tech cultures. While most of the study in these fields would be college-level, perhaps lab technicians can get away with having a good grounding in the basics. Also, it helps a lot if students arrive at their universities with a solid background in the skills they are supposed to learn there. Prospective doctors would add Physiology.

Skills that aid a person in keeping track of an understanding all the information in a high-tech society could be useful. Current Affairs represents keeping up to date on the news and currents of society and might be vital for a student's future prospects. If he doesn't know about any opportunities, he won't grab them. But the lack of information, as such, is rarely a problem in high-tech societies. Knowing the difference between quality data and bovine dung is. Someone who studied any of Economics, Expert Skill (Memetics), Expert Skill (Political Science), Intelligence Analysis, Market Analysis or Sociology will be much better equipped to understand the factors that affect him and his conditions. The History skill will frequently be learned in conjunction with Intelligence Analysis, as the higher levels of study in that field (as opposed to the trivia-memorisation of high schoolers today) involve the analysis of multiple sources in an attempt to determine the true factors that led to a given event or episode.

Someone with aptitude or interest in the arts might be pushed to pick up an Artist speciality, Performance, musical skills, Literature or Poetry. Philosophy or Theology are also fairly likely to be offered to those who show interest in these fields and it is possible that certain cultures emphasise them for all students.

Public Speaking suits those seeking to pursue careers in the limelight, as well as, likely, more Writing and perhaps some Dabbler in Administration and any of Finance, Law, Leadership, Politics, Teaching or other appropriate skills to the careers they seek.

Originally Posted by jacobmuller

Would there be any limit on the curriculum, eg no terrorist enabling? What happens to kids who just clear off and go looking for "fun", eg standing on street corners, wandering in fields?

Depends on their specific society. In general, there would be a lot of 'Who cares? We've got bigger problems than a certain percentage of our young lacking a good education. For one thing, TL10 means that a great portion of our work force have lower marginal value as labour than their cost of living. So as long as those kids are happy looking for fun, more power to them.'

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by jason taylor

They can also work early rather then(or as well as) matriculate early. A youth is fit for work far earlier then the present arrangement of the educational system allows. They can also marry earlier; more can marry in their twenties.

A TL10 society is highly likely to have quite enough people, so they don't need to encourage procreation, and a large group of people whose skills don't allow them to compete effectively with robots or bioroids.

Thus, it is in the interest of society that people should accumulate as much education as possible, in order to be employable as superior source of educated labour when compared to the cheaper mass-produced workers and that they should marry late.

Originally Posted by jason taylor

College level courses can be studied while in the process of work if widespread computer usage is available.

Of course.

But where will these people find work while they still don't have any skills that cannot be bought more cheaply at a robot or bioroid factory?

[Astromancer]

Originally Posted by ciaran_skye

I have my wonders how it would help with social skills. One complaint, unfounded or not, about home-schooling is a student's social skills are often lacking compared to more traditionally schooled peers.

I'll admit, the one person I have ongoing contact with who was home-schooled does have some of the worst social skills of anyone I know.

Now if this system was designed to encourage students to group together to solve a complex problem, especially if it could be programmed to match dissimilar personalities in ways that both have synergy and forces (due to the synergy) them to interact with people who they might otherwise not.

Group exercises, and social events can be factored in. Just because everybody is following and individual course of instruction, doesn't mean you can't get a regular group together to do a lab session or make use of the gym or the pool. Some resources would need to be shared, which would foster socialisation.

[Pragmatic]

There's that perk (in the Perks book, even...) that lets a character have improved defaults on up to eight skills for 1cp (with even higher defaults by "doubling up" on skills...). It was designed (according to some posts I've seen...) to reflect a generic liberal-arts education (i.e., the generic student coming out of college).

Why not simply allow the TL10 children have multiples of that perk?

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

There's that perk (in the Perks book, even...) that lets a character have improved defaults on up to eight skills for 1cp (with even higher defaults by "doubling up" on skills...). It was designed (according to some posts I've seen...) to reflect a generic liberal-arts education (i.e., the generic student coming out of college).

Why not simply allow the TL10 children have multiples of that perk?

Dabbler, yes. It has been mentioned.

[Astromancer]

I still think there'll be a place for human educators. The AI's working in cooperation (and being aware of the gifts of both students and teachers) would pair off kids and educators to promote the best results. AI's can do a huge amount, but there are human gifts and knacks of value too.

I'd vote for raising the IQ. However, while this type of education might enhance general knowledge, analytical and perception, I don't see that it would lead to giant wills (although it wouldn't weaken wills either). I could see a kid with and IQ of 15 except his will is 13, as a typical graduate of this system. Sure he/she would be listed as having a weak-will disadvantage, but their will would still be stronger than an IQ 10 person with two levels of strong will.

[cosmicfish]

I could get behind a "raised IQ + reduced Will" option, as it would seem reasonable, but even that may depend on the AI. It is likely that such AI's would be the result of extensive research and design efforts, and that they would also possess the ability to monitor certain physiological functions as part of adapting to the student. An individual who exhibited social awkwardness or a weak will may find their curriculum tweaked to bolster those areas.

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Astromancer

I still think there'll be a place for human educators. The AI's working in cooperation (and being aware of the gifts of both students and teachers) would pair off kids and educators to promote the best results. AI's can do a huge amount, but there are human gifts and knacks of value too.

Human teachers and/or full AI teachers would likely supervise and mentor the advanced students in creativity-related pursuits, in critical thinking, in abtruse reasoning and in various other fields where LAIs are weak. Also, of course, robots, bioroids or human teachers are invaluable when the advanced students wish to pursue hands-on education in areas relating to their prospective future careers.

Originally Posted by Astromancer

I'd vote for raising the IQ. However, while this type of education might enhance general knowledge, analytical and perception, I don't see that it would lead to giant wills (although it wouldn't weaken wills either). I could see a kid with and IQ of 15 except his will is 13, as a typical graduate of this system. Sure he/she would be listed as having a weak-will disadvantage, but their will would still be stronger than an IQ 10 person with two levels of strong will.

I agree. Levels of IQ gained through education should definitely not raise Per and Will.

[cosmicfish]

Originally Posted by Icelander

I agree. Levels of IQ gained through education should definitely not raise Per and Will.

Perception definitely CAN be trained, I am just not sure if it WOULD be. It would probably depend a lot on the politics of the society - many governments would prefer a smart but oblivious populace.