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Old 08-12-2014, 02:47 AM   #11
Not another shrubbery
 
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: Affliction

Just doing some solo-brainstorming on Affliction. Maybe change the buy-in cost to make the first level more expensive, while adapting the cheaper per level cost to improve it. Make the first level more effective somehow (maybe build Malediction in?). Affliction attacks often seem to be more (or sometimes less) effective than the underlying trait would suggest, so a review of the pricing scheme might be in order, especially WRT traits which have both offensive uses against foes, and buff utility when used on yourself or your allies.
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Old 08-12-2014, 07:45 AM   #12
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: Affliction

Afflictions can be complex and I'm no expert, but a couple of simple things occur looking at the basics of Affliction (Advantage)

Affliction 1 is [10] points

(Advantage) is an Enhancement worth +10% per point of the Advantage, e.g. Insubstantiality is an [80] points advantage, which is a +800% modifier, which is worth [+80] points!

- so, for Affliction 1, the additional cost to give someone else an Advantage (ignoring rolls), is the full cost (exactly 100%) of that advantage.

The biggest issue would seem to be that the +800% (or whatever) is applied to each level of the Afflictions, so Affliction 2, increases the cost of the 'Advantage' part to 2x [80] = [160] points, etc.

Since extra levels of Affliction primarily increase the penalties on the resistance roll - could this not be replaced with something akin to the Reliable/Resistible or Accurate/Inaccurate Modifiers (all of which are ±5% per ±1)?
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Old 08-12-2014, 08:51 AM   #13
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: Affliction

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Originally Posted by SCAR View Post
Afflictions can be complex and I'm no expert, but a couple of simple things occur looking at the basics of Affliction (Advantage)

Affliction 1 is [10] points

(Advantage) is an Enhancement worth +10% per point of the Advantage, e.g. Insubstantiality is an [80] points advantage, which is a +800% modifier, which is worth [+80] points!

- so, for Affliction 1, the additional cost to give someone else an Advantage (ignoring rolls), is the full cost (exactly 100%) of that advantage.

The biggest issue would seem to be that the +800% (or whatever) is applied to each level of the Afflictions, so Affliction 2, increases the cost of the 'Advantage' part to 2x [80] = [160] points, etc.

Since extra levels of Affliction primarily increase the penalties on the resistance roll - could this not be replaced with something akin to the Reliable/Resistible or Accurate/Inaccurate Modifiers (all of which are ±5% per ±1)?
There are a number of issues here.

First, for 90 points, you can give insubstantiality to anyone around you, for some minutes. You can also give it to yourself. True, it's outside of your control (so you can not turn substantial at will, you need to wait for the duration to expire) but for 10 points, you get to share insubstantiality around. Affects Others, however, costs +50% and lets you share with one individual, who (baring further modifiers) needs to remain in contact with you. That cost discrepancy is the reason I created the Aura of Power meta-modifier (see Pyramid #3/19 and Power-Ups: Enhancements)

Second, your suggestion is WAY too cheap. For 30 points, your targets are perma-stunned? (HT-20 to recover)? I feel that +50% per -1 would work though, being the same as raising will once you have malediction.
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Old 08-12-2014, 09:30 AM   #14
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: Affliction

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There are a number of issues here.

First, for 90 points, you can give insubstantiality to anyone around you, for some minutes. You can also give it to yourself. True, it's outside of your control (so you can not turn substantial at will, you need to wait for the duration to expire) but for 10 points, you get to share insubstantiality around. Affects Others, however, costs +50% and lets you share with one individual, who (baring further modifiers) needs to remain in contact with you. That cost discrepancy is the reason I created the Aura of Power meta-modifier (see Pyramid #3/19 and Power-Ups: Enhancements)
That's what it costs now: Affliction 1 (Advantage, Insubstantiality, +800%) [90]. [10] for Affliction 1 and [+80] for Insubstantiality

Other modifiers on the Affliction have no affect on the cost of the 'Advantage' part (or whatever effect the affliction has). (unless you hit the -80% limit possibly)

Affliction 2 (Advantage, Insubstantiality, +800%) should perhaps be [100]. [20] for Affliction 2 and [+80] for Insubstantiality? or is that still too cheap?

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Second, your suggestion is WAY too cheap. For 30 points, your targets are perma-stunned? (HT-20 to recover)? I feel that +50% per -1 would work though, being the same as raising will once you have malediction.
That would be true, however: Cosmic, Irresistible attack is +300% (or [+30] points on Affliction 1) which is only slightly more expensive, doesn't allow for any roll if the victim somehow has Resistance, or Super HT, etc. , and is how it currently works, is it not.

The way it currently works, you multiply the 'cost' of the Afflictions 'effect' by the Level of the Affliction, which doesn't seem balanced with the primary effect of increased Level which is an increase penalty to the resistance roll.

I supposed what I'm getting at is should the Delivery Mechanism (the Affliction Attack) be priced independently of the Effect?
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Old 08-12-2014, 09:38 AM   #15
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: Affliction

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That would be true, however: Cosmic, Irresistible attack is +300% (or [+30] points on Affliction 1) which is only slightly more expensive, doesn't allow for any roll if the victim somehow has Resistance, or Super HT, etc. , and is how it currently works, is it not.
Irresistible Attack would nullify Resistant, and armor, but it would still allow you to resist with your standard HT. The only way to completely negate resistance for non-malediction afflictions is to pile up enough levels that your success chance drops under 3 (Maledictions have a slightly easier time, with cosmic, no rule of 16 and sky high Will).
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Old 08-12-2014, 09:48 AM   #16
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: Affliction

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Irresistible Attack would nullify Resistant, and armor, but it would still allow you to resist with your standard HT. The only way to completely negate resistance for non-malediction afflictions is to pile up enough levels that your success chance drops under 3 (Maledictions have a slightly easier time, with cosmic, no rule of 16 and sky high Will).
Ah yes, I see, now that I read the reference in Power-Ups 4 properly.

It still seems overly expensive to multiple the 'Effect Cost' by the 'Level', when the 'Effect' is unchanged by the Level, only the resistance roll.

It's not totally silly, because making it harder to resists a minor inconvenience effect should cost less than resisting major, nasty, incapacitating effects.
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Old 08-12-2014, 10:13 AM   #17
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: Affliction

Give Affliction a base cost of 10 and buy increased chance to punch through defenses as enhancements rather than extra levels. +25%?
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Old 08-12-2014, 10:48 AM   #18
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: Affliction

10/3 is fine for affliction, but boy does it make maledictions even more crazy than then already tend to be in games.
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Old 08-12-2014, 12:32 PM   #19
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: Affliction

It's been pointed out that Affliction can be simulated with builds like Small Piercing Attack (No Blunt Trauma, -20%; No Wounding, -50%; Side Effect, +50% or more) [2.7+/dice]. Although the mechanic is somewhat different, and RAW Side Effect isn't as flexible as Affliction, that basically works out to pricing Affliction at [1.5/level] (2.7/3.5×2), with enhancements working off a much cheaper base cost.

I've toyed with the idea of making the base cost of Affliction be the cost of the effect it's afflicting. That way enhancement and limitations scale to the effect produced, not the ability to affect others.
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Old 08-13-2014, 07:16 AM   #20
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: Affliction

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10/3 is fine for affliction, but boy does it make maledictions even more crazy than then already tend to be in games.
It's possible Malediction ought to be its own trait, separate from Affliction and separate from Buff Ally. Sometimes it's actually simpler to have a larger number of purpose-specific traits than to have one trait that you then try to force to jump through a billion wildly different hoops.
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