11-02-2011, 04:10 PM | #31 | |
GURPS Line Editor
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Montréal, Québec
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Re: Wizard Vows
Staying on-topic this time:
Quote:
Armor-related Vows are trickier. I would take everything down a class for wizards:
Collectively, this would make your wizard Vows worth -15 points, which is about the limit for Vows. I would not let gear-related Vows stack up to -20 points or worse for anybody. This is not strictly true. You can break a Vow and there is a game-mechanical penalty: You have to pay off the Vow, because it's now clear that you don't take it seriously. If you can't afford to pay it off, then the GM gets to withhold points until it's paid off . . . or just give you a new disadvantage to replace it, like Reputation (Oath-breaker) or reduced Magery. That's what "If you want to end a Vow before its stated time, the GM may exact a penalty" is getting at.
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Sean "Dr. Kromm" Punch <kromm@sjgames.com> GURPS Line Editor, Steve Jackson Games My DreamWidth [Just GURPS News] |
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11-02-2011, 04:22 PM | #32 |
Never Been Pretty
Join Date: Jan 2005
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Re: Wizard Vows
Thank you.
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11-02-2011, 04:27 PM | #33 | |
GURPS Line Editor
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Montréal, Québec
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Re: Wizard Vows
Quote:
In my examples, I assumed a wizard because it appears that wizardly powers are to be tied up in the question. Remember that "No edged weapons" for clerics, when chosen, explicitly forms the basis of a Pact limitation that costs the cleric his powers if he picks up a blade! As has been hinted at here, the same Vow would be a free 10 points for a warrior with ST 20, Two-Handed Axe/Mace-20, and a huge maul. Likewise, my armor Vows took into account that wizards don't need armor as much as other characters – not with Armor spells, Shield spells, Iron Arm, etc., and not given that their profession isn't "warrior" but "support." It also matters what the consequences are. It would be perfectly fair to say that wizards must take Vow [-10] to purify their minds to learn magic, but can then break the Vow later on at the cost of a level of Magery. The net effect on point value would be 0, but the wizard would really have to want to break the Vow! That isn't the same as the cleric case (a cleric loses his powers, he doesn't just drop a level of Power Investiture) because the wizard has no Pact. If a cleric's Pact were more severe, his Vow would rise to match it. These character-specific considerations are a big part of pricing Vows.
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Sean "Dr. Kromm" Punch <kromm@sjgames.com> GURPS Line Editor, Steve Jackson Games My DreamWidth [Just GURPS News] |
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11-02-2011, 04:32 PM | #34 |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: The ASS of the world, mainly Valencia, Spain (Europe)
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Re: Wizard Vows
Kromm, a vow to only ever use NERF weapons (and not even fight unarmed) would be even more restrictive that one that forces you to fight unarmed xD
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11-02-2011, 04:35 PM | #35 |
GURPS Line Editor
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Montréal, Québec
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Re: Wizard Vows
I'd give -15 points for that one. :)
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Sean "Dr. Kromm" Punch <kromm@sjgames.com> GURPS Line Editor, Steve Jackson Games My DreamWidth [Just GURPS News] |
11-02-2011, 04:53 PM | #36 | |
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Silver Spring, MD
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Re: Wizard Vows
Quote:
If you can't break it, that's a curse or something. Vows are breakable--you're not supposed to break it, but you can. I think you're confused because the book says "Many Vows end after a specified period of time," but those are vows like "for the next year, I won't eat cake." If it's a Vow and you break it, you feel guilty. If it's a curse, then you, I dunno, get turned into a cake yourself. Or get smote by the gods of evil baking. |
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11-02-2011, 07:00 PM | #37 |
Join Date: Oct 2009
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Re: Wizard Vows
I think Kuroshima would want to play a NERFed Mystic Knight. Would that still be a -15?
More seriously, why is "no edged weapons" worth -10 points? I just don't see it unless the PC has already put points into edged weapons. And even then, you can still use training weapons with cr instead of cut damage at full skill. You could get +2 Striking ST for this after all. Sure, it sounds like a severe thing, but let's compare it to Vow ("Never speak") [-15]. That makes a wizard completely useless (unless he has very high skill). The "no edged weapons" only inconveniences a fighter (the class that is supposed to depend on weapons). Also, "Never speak" applies in way more situations than just combat. It affects anyone using social interactions. It's bad for Leadership/Tactics in combat etc. There's a reason "Mute" is worth [-25] even to character concepts that don't especially rely on speech. So why is "Never speak" only [-15]? From this I draw the conclusion that Vow ("Never speak") [-15] is appropriately priced, but "no edged weapons" is way too munchkinny. You could also say that a Vow should cost as much as the disadvantage it represents and price Never Speak as [-25]. I don't agree but I also think Vows can be broken on rare occasions without lasting consequences (if you try to restore yourself in front of your god etc), so they aren't quite as severe as the real disadvantage. (I've already tried to expand on this upthread to accomodate different kinds of Vows, in particular those that cannot be broken ...) Thanks for any insight into "No edged weapons"! Ts |
11-02-2011, 08:01 PM | #38 | |
Join Date: Sep 2011
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Re: Wizard Vows
Quote:
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11-02-2011, 09:35 PM | #39 |
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Re: Wizard Vows
Vow: Do One-Third to One-Half Injury To All Targets [-10]
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11-03-2011, 12:22 AM | #40 | ||
Never Been Pretty
Join Date: Jan 2005
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Re: Wizard Vows
Quote:
Quote:
You only get points for a Vow if you take it seriously, or in other words you're not going to break it. If you do break it, you're not serious about it and it no longer gives you extra points. It is thus no longer a Disadvantage. A Vow not to use edged weapons is worth -10 points. But a vow not to use edged weapons isn't worth anything. You break a vow and you feel guilty for a time, but then continue as normal, the vow still in place. If you break a Vow, you lose points and the Vow is gone. |
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Tags |
dragonlance, vow, wizard |
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