Density Manipulation combined with Gravity control

[hoganbball23]

Hi all. Long time lurker first time poster. I am working on a high tech (TL10) zombies campaign. Basically there is a small number of people exposed to the zombie virus that gain superpowers. As such we have two NPC's named castor and pollux.

Castor can manipulate the gravity of one person, and only one person that is not himself, at a time. He can make them rise very high or crush them. For Castor i think i have it worked out the way i like it. He has

Advantages: Control (Gravity), Binding with Unbreakable, Innate Attack (Ranged, Crushing, Irresistible (4d CR/Sec)

Pollux i cannot figure out. I want him to be able to manipulate his own density, and only his own, to extreme highs and lows. Basically I know that Alternate Form: Insubstantial works for the low end but how do i do the high end?

In my perfect world, Castor accelerates an incredibly dense pollux from far up in the sky and his impact with the earth is equivalent to a huge bomb, but all in slam damage. Is that possible? And if so how do i go about doing it?

[Refplace]

Affliction, self only Increase Densty with DR and IT for crushing only when afflicted.

[whswhs]

Morph with Mass Conservation is -20%. That suggests that the ability to alter one's mass is worth around 20 points. That approach doesn't have a leveled aspect.

Growth might be bought with Mass Only for around -50%. It would not change your dimensions but would boost your weight.

The comparison to Growth suggests that you have a required ST for each mass and density. I would probably allow ST to be bought with "Weight" or "Density" at -5% for each step of weight increase on the SM scale. (Six SM steps give you x10 linear dimensions, so x1000 weight; one step gives you x3 weight, and two steps give you x10, approximately.) You wouldn't get the full modifier because being heavier doesn't hinder you as much as being bigger and heavier.

[Kuroshima]

I personally see being able to alter one's density as a set of alternate abilities (or maybe alternate forms, or morph, if it ends up saving points that way). On the low end, it is certainly insubstantial and/or Injury Tolerance (Diffuse) plus Flight (Lighter Than Air). For the high end, I personally feel that increased HP with maybe Injury Tolerance (Damage Reduction) would work. HP is often a proxy for mass in GURPS (it certainly works that way for collisions and slams).

[lexington]

Originally Posted by hoganbball23

Pollux i cannot figure out. I want him to be able to manipulate his own density, and only his own, to extreme highs and lows.

First decide what he should be capable of and then build "Low Density Body" and "High Density Body" as templates and using Alternate Form to buy them.



If he stays the same size then of course his mass will change which means more HP when denser and less HP with rarefied. (I assume that this is based on a character like The Vision. If not then Growth and Shrinking would be the places to start) Low mass, without loss of strength, means some levels of Super Jump or maybe Flight with Lighter Than Air.

High density is usually associated with super strength and damage resistance. Certainly Striking ST is justifiable since punches and kick will have more mass behind them, Lifting ST maybe not so much.

Originally Posted by hoganbball23

Basically I know that Alternate Form: Insubstantial works for the low end but how do i do the high end?

This is a weird thing that comic books decided on for some reason that I'll never understand. You can't phase through thing by lowering your density. It makes sense for a silly campaign but otherwise Injury Tolerance (Diffuse) is the best you can hope for.

Originally Posted by hoganbball23

In my perfect world, Castor accelerates an incredibly dense pollux from far up in the sky and his impact with the earth is equivalent to a huge bomb, but all in slam damage. Is that possible? And if so how do i go about doing it?

I struggle to see this not killing Pollux but in a cinematic or comic book campaign you could probably take Injury Tolerance (Damage Reduction) with a version of Cosmic that also scales your effective HP for the purposes of stuff like Slams and resisting Knockback.

[Phantasm]

I haven't messed with density-controllers yet in my Marvel Reboot project, but I can see the following:

For a high-density character, he'd gain ST, HP, DR, and IT:DR proportionate to the increase in his mass. For ST and HP, I'd work this way: A character who increases his density to 3x human norm would weigh about 3x as much and have a BL about 3x normal. For a 150 lb. (68 kg) person with a normal ST 10 and BL 20 lbs, at 3x density he'd have roughly ST 17, BL 58 lbs. At 10x mass, he'd have to be 10x as strong, or BL 200 lbs for ST 31.6 (round to ST 32). Not really sure how to scale his DR, but I can see IT:DR roughly equal to the mass multiplier (round appropriately for proper cost).

[Christopher R. Rice]

Any reason why you're not using Control Density?

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

Any reason why you're not using Control Density?

Well, density is neither a substance like air or metal, a form of energy like light or sound, or a force like pressure or friction. So it's not really clear that it applies. I'm not sure there is even a suitable abstract category. I mean, it's a ratio, like Reynolds number, and I wouldn't let somebody have Control Reynolds Number.

The underlying mechanic for what you want seems to be similar to that of Growth. You want to have greater mass and weight; you need to buy greater ST to be able to move under that greater mass and weight; you probably get a discount on ST, if you can only use it when your mass and weight are boosted.

Or, if you can turn into a specific substance with a higher density, like Colossus turning into steel, you have Alternate Form.

Either of those seems an easier fit to this particular effect.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by whswhs

Well, density is neither a substance like air or metal, a form of energy like light or sound, or a force like pressure or friction. So it's not really clear that it applies. I'm not sure there is even a suitable abstract category. I mean, it's a ratio, like Reynolds number, and I wouldn't let somebody have Control Reynolds Number.

The underlying mechanic for what you want seems to be similar to that of Growth. You want to have greater mass and weight; you need to buy greater ST to be able to move under that greater mass and weight; you probably get a discount on ST, if you can only use it when your mass and weight are boosted.

Or, if you can turn into a specific substance with a higher density, like Colossus turning into steel, you have Alternate Form.

Either of those seems an easier fit to this particular effect.

I'd just treat it as a force myself. It's not a perfect fit - and I'd call it at least 25/level (maybe even a form of God-like Control so it's 30/level) - but it would remove some of the fussier builds. PK wrote an article about this in the old Pyramid 2.0 called "More Powers for Powers" that covered this well, though I'll note that it doesn't use Control either.

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

I'd just treat it as a force myself. It's not a perfect fit - and I'd call it at least 25/level (maybe even a form of God-like Control so it's 30/level) - but it would remove some of the fussier builds. PK wrote an article about this in the old Pyramid 2.0 called "More Powers for Powers" that covered this well, though I'll note that it doesn't use Control either.

I obviously don't have any deep aversion to using Control; I used some rather abstract versions of it in my current project. But I'm just not seeing how building this one as a Control makes it simpler.