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Old 06-29-2017, 12:22 AM   #1
Highland_Piper
 
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Default MH Thaumatology for Dummies?

First off I've got more experience just doing bog standard fantasy/dungeon fantasy then any kind of genre. My two different groups are testing my patience by playing genre's that I don't have any experience in.

Thaumatology is doing my head in. There doesn't seem to be any basic 'spells' for Monster Hunters at all. Does everything have to be custom built by the GM? Bad enough one of the players are doing a Voodoo priestess thing which there is no information for except a 3e book which does not fit into my MH campaign at all.

Despite MH pgs 33-39 I can not figure out how to make a simple warding ritual for the Voodoo character and they even have 'examples'

Could some one explain it in plain English?
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Old 06-29-2017, 12:31 AM   #2
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Default Re: MH Thaumatology for Dummies?

GURPS Thaumatology: Ritual Path Magic has an extensive list of rituals for your Witch.

However your voudoun Crusader is even simpler, just use the abilities listed on pg. 42 for the Mysticism power (or expand it with GURPS Powers: Divine Favor).

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Old 06-29-2017, 12:39 AM   #3
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Default Re: MH Thaumatology for Dummies?

I think the other problem I'm having is these characters are going from Side kick to Hero and I'm finding it increasingly difficult to get them to the 400 point stage.

I'm about to just throw in the towel and make them remake their characters at 400 points but that would destroy most of the progress they have been making.

Someone should write a Pyramid article for MH about how to go from 150-200 point side kick to full 400 point Hero. Proper point progression and all that.
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Old 06-29-2017, 07:00 AM   #4
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Default Re: MH Thaumatology for Dummies?

MH1 describes how to create spells starting on page 33. Basically, you need to first decide what the effects are. Then you go pick the matching modifers from the tables so you can calculate the spell's energy cost.

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Every spell must be defined clearly; e.g., “Using Lesser Strengthen Mind, everyone within four yards of me at the time that I cast the spell will gain +2 to Per for the next hour.” That definition includes the spell effect (Lesser Strengthen Mind) and all of the applicable modifiers (area of effect, range, altered traits, and duration).
You and the GM will need to agree on exactly which Paths are required to create the desired effect ("Destroy Body", "Create Crossroads", etc) and whether the effect is Greater or Lesser. (That is, whether or not the spell could plausibly pass for a relatively "normal" occurrence, or is obviously supernatural.) See also the "Defining Rituals" box on pg 39, which isn't a checklist, but does give you a list of all the items that are central enough to define a ritual as a particular spell (why, that's "Mordenkainen's Mysterious Magical Melange"!), and which you'd normally vary on the fly (this particular casting does more damage, or lasts longer, or affects more people).

RPM is meant to be a flexible system where witches adapt spells to their circumstances and needs, so it's long on procedure and short on spell lists. The separate RPM book ("Thaumatology: Ritual Path Magic") goes into more detail on creating spells and has dozens of examples. ("Define the Ritual" starts on page 15; "The Grimoire" runs from pp 38 - 51.)

Did you have an example in mind? The forum could work through it (no doubt in a multitude of ways, each with their own virtues and spawning arcane sub-arguments, which you might find more confusing than helpful). But you could see how people approach the problem.
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Old 06-29-2017, 09:12 AM   #5
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Default Re: MH Thaumatology for Dummies?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Highland_Piper View Post
I think the other problem I'm having is these characters are going from Side kick to Hero and I'm finding it increasingly difficult to get them to the 400 point stage.

I'm about to just throw in the towel and make them remake their characters at 400 points but that would destroy most of the progress they have been making.

Someone should write a Pyramid article for MH about how to go from 150-200 point side kick to full 400 point Hero. Proper point progression and all that.
I've GM'ed a lot of MH. It's my group's favorite. I would not try to change a 200 pt side kick into a 400 point Champion. As they get points, let the players put points into anything on their sidekick template or the equivalent Champion template. The results will not look like a standard champion, but who cares. It will be close enough & have the right flavor.

As for the ritual path magic, as sir pudding said, check out the RPM book and their are plenty of threads on this forum for RPM spells.
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Old 06-29-2017, 11:11 AM   #6
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Default Re: MH Thaumatology for Dummies?

http://gurps-monsterhunters.appspot.com/

I'm not affiliated with this at all. But it's wonderful to quickly design spells and roll for success.
Remember that there is more than one way to build an effect. So no need to sweat that you're doing it the one true correct way.
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Old 06-29-2017, 12:07 PM   #7
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Default Re: MH Thaumatology for Dummies?

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Originally Posted by Highland_Piper View Post
Someone should write a Pyramid article for MH about how to go from 150-200 point side kick to full 400 point Hero. Proper point progression and all that.
Niche protection seems less important in Monster Hunters than it does in Dungeon Fantasy, in a lot of the source material, at least the serial sources, there tends to be a fair amount of cross-training. Can you elaborate on some of the specific problems you are seeing?
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Old 07-14-2017, 11:28 AM   #8
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Default Re: MH Thaumatology for Dummies?

My biggest problem with Thaumatology and Ritual Path Magic is I'm both Dyslexic and dyscalculia and I'm finding next to impossible to understand any of it.

All I'm trying to do right now is figure out a spell that pushes people away without causing damage and I just can't figure out how to do it. It is extremely difficult to slog through it all and I don't find it very well written/organized or simple to understand. There is not enough examples given for me to understand how it works. This is an issue with my learning disability.

Things I want to do

Spell that pushes people away from the caster up to 10 yards at a rate of 3 yards per second. So 1 hex per turn. How would you go about this? Would there be any kind of resisting available by the target? If some one could kindly give me a step by step instruction then maybe that can be the rosetta stone I need to figure out other spells on my own.

Thank you
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Old 07-14-2017, 01:05 PM   #9
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Default Re: MH Thaumatology for Dummies?

I'll try to help with this spell and go through the steps of making a spell in general - hopefully this will help make it clearer!

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Spell that pushes people away from the caster up to 10 yards at a rate of 3 yards per second. So 1 hex per turn.
First of all, 3 yards per second is actually 3 hexes a turn, since 1 hex = 1 yard, and 1 turn = 1 second. I'll assume you actually wanted 1 hex a turn.

So, the first step in any ritual is to decide which Path and effect you are going to use to accomplish this. The Path defines what type of being, object, or force you're manipulating with the magic, and the effect defines how you're manipulating it. For this effect, there's a couple of ways you could do this. The most obvious is to use the Path of Energy, which governs kinetic force, to simply generate a "push" that moves everything in its area. But if you wanted to define the effect as specifically controlling flesh, and forcing it to move away from the source, you could use the Path of Body, while if the effect focused on giving people a mental compulsion to move, it could use the Path of Mind.

Once you've picked the Path, you need to decide the effect it's using - this will vary depending on how you define the ritual as well, and on which Path you choose - different Paths will often need different effects to accomplish the same goal. In this effect, if we use the Path of Energy, we'll need to use Create as the effect - it's just generating kinetic force out of nowhere. If you picked the Path of Body or Path of Mind instead, you could use Control, since in both cases, commanding the person's body or mind to do something it could choose to do is a control effect.

Once you've got the effect, you need to decide if it's a lesser or greater effect. The boundaries here are laid out in the various descriptions of the effects for each Path skill, in the Ritual Path Magic book. In the case of Create Energy, it's a greater effect - creating kinetic energy out of nowhere, in a place where it wouldn't "normally" exist. For Control Body or Control Mind, it's probably a reasonable lesser effect - in either case, it's basically causing them to take a step, which is a free action that doesn't really impose serious penalties.

Take note of the energy cost listed for the effect you choose - 6 for Create, or 5 for Control.

Once you've chosen your path and effect, you need to check if any modifiers apply. Without modifiers, this ritual will affect one person, once, so we're going to need to expand that a bit. It's definitely an Area of Effect, and you want it to affect 10 yards, so we check what the Area of Effect modifier says, finding a 10-yard distance on the Size and Speed/Range Table, and doubling the associated modifier, to +8 energy.

The other modifier all three of these affects will need is Duration, since they do go on for more than 1 second. The lowest possible duration modifier is 10 minutes, so we'll use that. That adds +1 energy.

The Create Energy and Control Body effects, since they're affecting physical mass, should also use the Subject Weight modifier. You only need a modifier based on the single heaviest object to be moved, so if you want to reliably move a human-sized target, you can choose the 300 lbs. weight, for +3 energy. If you want to be pushing something notably larger, or just really guaranteeing you get even the most overweight possible person, use the 1000 lbs. value, for +4 energy.

Once you've got all your modifiers, add them all to the base energy cost for the effect you want. Then, multiply them by the factor indicated in the table under "Greater Effects Multiplier".

So, let's go over the three versions of the ritual I've explained, and get the final cost.

We'll call the Create Energy version "Kinetic Push". Once cast, it creates an invisible kinetic force that pushes everything in the area away from the center, up to the weight limit of 1000 lbs., at 1 yard per second, out to the edge of the spell's radius, 10 yards, and lasts 10 minutes once cast. Subjects resist with ST (this is a special effect - normally they resist with HT or Will, but I think ST is reasonable in this case). This costs 6 (for Create) + 8 (for a 10-yard Area of Effect) + 1 (for a 10-minute duration) + 4 (for a 1000 lbs. weight limit) X 3 (for a single Greater effect), for a final energy cost of 57.

The Control Body one can be called "Step Away". Once cast, every creature inside the 10-yard-radius area must make a HT roll to resist the spell, or be forced to take one step away from the center of the area. It can affect any creature up to 1000 lbs., and lasts for 10 minutes. This costs 5 (for Control) + 8 (for a 10-yard Area of Effect) + 1 (for a 10-minute duration) + 4 (for a 1000 lbs. weight limit) X 1 (for no Greater effects), for a final energy cost of 18.

The Control Mind one we'll call "Controlled Pace". Once cast, every living creature with a mind (so, probably excluding things like insects, slime molds, and so forth, anything with IQ 1 or lower) must roll Will to resist, or be forced to take one step away from the center of the area. It lasts for 10 minutes. This costs 5 (for Control) + 8 (for a 10-yard Area of Effect) + 1 (for a 10-minute duration) X 1 (for no Greater effects), for a final energy cost of 14.

So, did that all make sense? Does this help understand the system at all?
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Old 07-14-2017, 04:00 PM   #10
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Default Re: MH Thaumatology for Dummies?

Cheers that does help.

Is there anyway to get the cost down, because at 57 points it will take ages to accumulate enough energy to actually cast that. I'm guessing on the average of over a minute.

The Control Mind & body options does the target get to resist at all as you are actually taking control away from themselves?
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