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Old 03-14-2017, 08:59 AM   #51
Phil Masters
 
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Default Re: Discworld, Dungeonworld

Nonhuman Races

One thing that gives a fantasy world its specific flavour is the particular nonhuman races (if any) present there, so a dungeoneering game set on the Disc really needs to use Discworld races to feel right. (Well, mostly. Some races out of Dungeon Fantasy 3 might be squeezed in. I'll get back to that.) We can use the racial templates from the Discworld RPG and the rules for nonhuman PCs from Dungeon Fantasy 3; the one thing that creates a minor anomaly is that "Longevity" is treated as a perk in Discworld and included in several templates, whereas the concept is just excluded from Dungeone Fantasy, but whatever; either drop the cost of those templates by a point, or treat it as an excuse for the character to know some historical snippets and partial immunity to the very occasional freaky "ageing" magical attack.

Anyway, let's look at each case in turn:

Dwarfs are gratifyingly easy. It's not hard to find the points for a 27-point template, and dwarfs are natural dungeoneers. Dwarfish Greed would work just fine in dungeon games, and some of the racial quirks could serve as decent downtime roleplaying hooks. The only thing is that the Metalwork Talent is a bit marginal for dungeon games, but actually, note that it also covers two skills that are excluded from Dungeon Fantasy games (Mechanic and Metallurgy); excluding those makes it a 5-skill and hence 5-point Talent. Put two levels of the Talent into the template to preserve the cost, and your dwarfs become natural artificers or just handy characters to have along to fix the occasional damaged weapon.

Gargoyles are maybe less of a natural fit, especially with the Can't Wear Armour thing, and the 46 point template cost is a bit of a bind. Still, innate DR 5-8, ST 15, and Night Vision 4 aren't to be sniffed at, so why not have a bit of dungeon architecture who decides to join a passing party? Hidebound and Innumerate aren't approved DF disadvantages, but meh - roleplay them to heck.

Gnomes and Pictsies are a bit weird for this task, but Nac mac Feegle aren't likely to turn down the idea of violent adventure, and gnomes might reckon to act as thief types, then duck and run like blazes if things turn dangerous. Silence isn't on the list of approved advantages, but I don't know why not.

Banshees are basically psychopaths, which might not exclude them from dungeon adventuring, but they also have a 72-point template with a lot of the points going on Winged Flight, so I suggest leaving them out.

Elf-Kin have a cheap template and a DX bonus. If you want a character who should, if the GM is playing things right, get beaten up a lot by dwarfs, trolls, and scholars, who am I to argue?

Goblins could be roped into dungeoneering parties against their better judgement... I guess that they're more plausibly sordid hireling types (play them as Baldrick-in-the-dungeon), and the low ST has got to sting anyone who tries to play them as combatants, while some players are going to whine tiresomely at having to spend 24 points on a useless craft skill, but hey, decent DX and Night Vision 6! Plus, the last novel implies that they're remarkably good with technology when they try, so why not use them as artificers?

Gnolls are strong and rugged, but dumb, slow, and incapable of wearing armour. But they're cheap on points, and including a walking compost heap in your party has to be good for an easy laugh.

Golems have a 438-point template cost. Sorry.

To Be Continued...
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Old 03-14-2017, 09:21 AM   #52
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Default Re: Discworld, Dungeonworld

A bit off-topic for the thread, but have you considered combining Monster Hunters and Discworld, for high-powered adventures where the very fabric of reality is threatened? Could make a nice Pyramid article.
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Old 03-14-2017, 11:16 AM   #53
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Default Re: Discworld, Dungeonworld

One thing I should have noted sooner; the Tiny Tools rule (Dungeon Fantasy 3, p. 8) might apply for gnomes/pictsies and goblins, but not for dwarfs -- if the GM is prepared to imagine armourers working for either of those two rather marginal species. (This would replace the simpler approach taken in the Discworld RPG.) However, if gnomes or pictsies actually start wearing useful armour, that should logically trash the "Cannot Wear Armour" limitation on their DR, increasing the cost of their racial template.
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Old 03-14-2017, 11:34 AM   #54
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Default Re: Discworld, Dungeonworld

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One thing I should have noted sooner; the Tiny Tools rule (Dungeon Fantasy 3, p. 8) might apply for gnomes/pictsies and goblins, but not for dwarfs -- if the GM is prepared to imagine armourers working for either of those two rather marginal species.
Pictsies canonically have swords, so someone makes them.
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Old 03-14-2017, 02:08 PM   #55
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Default Re: Discworld, Dungeonworld

Okay, sure, somebody is making pictsie-sized blades. (Probably a pictsie with an especially epic accent and line in BS.) But serious armour, or bows or crossbows?

I think that treating all weapons at that scale as some kind of dagger or knife is close enough for government work. Not that pictsies would want anything to do with government work, of course.
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Old 03-14-2017, 05:37 PM   #56
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Default Re: Discworld, Dungeonworld

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think that treating all weapons at that scale as some kind of dagger or knife is close enough for government work. Not that pictsies would want anything to do with government work, of course.
That's how I handle it. I just made a Disadvantage restricting tiny characters to a small selection of weak weapons rather than using the scaling rules for weapons, it just feels more right to me.
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Old 03-14-2017, 06:48 PM   #57
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Scholars
Without access to Enthrallment skills and possibly to spells (depending on how you work magic) the Wild Talent is a little less useful.
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Old 03-14-2017, 07:26 PM   #58
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Default Re: Discworld, Dungeonworld

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Okay, sure, somebody is making pictsie-sized blades. (Probably a pictsie with an especially epic accent and line in BS.) ...
I always assumed that they got their swords from the same place(s) that the bars that put umbrellas in drinks got their sword-shaped swizzle sticks. (Without access to plastic, the swizzle sticks on the Disc could possibly be made of metal. Maybe. And aren't those the right size for pictsies to use as actual blades?)
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Old 03-17-2017, 12:38 AM   #59
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"We suspect you're smuggling enough swords to equip a regiment of Pictsies! Turn out your pockets!"
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Old 03-22-2017, 08:05 AM   #60
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Nonhuman Races, Continued

Sapient Animals don't really seem like a good idea in Dungeon Fantasy - probably no armour, no weapons (magical or otherwise), and a lot of trivial practical problems - but they're an occasional canonical part of the setting, and I guess that sooner or later someone will think it's appropriately Discworld-ish to play Gaspode the Wonder Dog in a dungeon (with supercanine skills), or a talking dungeoneers' mule. They might work okay as Henchmen; perhaps stack a template from Dungeon Fantasy 15 (with modifications, because of the lack of hands) on top of an enhanced animal.

Trolls are rather well-suited to dungeon plundering, being strong, robust, and never averse to hitting things. I'd suggest sticking the Moderate-Sized Troll template, though; an SM greater than +1 should logically have serious practical problems in a dungeon. The other snag is of course the fact that template costs 83 points. So, rather than using any of the standard DF occupational templates, I'd start with the Tough Troll (Discworld RPG, p. 145), choosing dungeon-appropriate optional skills, then add +1 to Brawling [+2] and +1 to any two other Primary Skills [+4 each], and then drop another 40 points into physical Attributes or Secondary Characteristics.

Vampires mostly fit the antagonist/boss monster role rather than the adventurer function in dungeon games. Sure, there are sympathetic vampire characters in the novels, but they're black ribboners - and a vampire adventurer would end up spilling an awful lot of blood, which would represent intolerable levels of temptation. Also, the aversion to direct sunlight, and any other optional hang-ups about fire and such, could be regarded by the rest of the party as a bloomin' nuisance.

Still, one could have an all-monster party or something. Vampire templates are expensive, but the simple approach would be to take one, add 17 or 18 points of miscellaneous neat stuff (or more if one also adds more common vampiric disadvantages), then combine it with a 125-point Henchman template from Dungeon Fantasy 15.

Werewolves and Wolfmen are mostly just too weird and confusing for dungeon duties, but I suppose that someone might have fun with a seemingly under-powered adventurer with the ability to shift voluntarily to wolfman form at crucial moments. Statting this up is left as an exercise; once again, the henchmen templates from DF 15 might be a good start for the human side of the character.

Zombies are the last Discworld race to discuss, and a third example of a monster race with an expensive racial template... Hmm, how about a bargain-value henchman from DF 15 who got killed in the first room, and was so annoyed that he came back out of sheer cussedness to continue the mission? Combing the 178-point Zombie template with a 62-point occupational template even gives you 10 points extra to spend on essential stuff like Sewing skill.

Dungeon Fantasy 3 Races

Previous comments notwithstanding, there are a few races in DF 3 that might work on the Disc.

Cat-Folk should probably come from the Agatean Empire, have large eyes even by feline standards, and complain a lot about all the fanboys, once they start venturing down from their remote mountain villages and taking up dungeon-plundering.

Dark Ones and Elder-Spawn might be humans or elf-kin who've been tainted by horrible emanations from the Dungeon Dimensions, probably following an accident with a dimensional portal. Discworld wizards and priests might well regard them as too creepy to associate with, though.

Lizard Men do exist on the Disc, though they're rare and not much described - so the DF type could be used in play. The hint, at least in the illustrations to The Last Hero, is that Discworld lizard men are small and wiry rather than brawny, but whatever.

Wildmen could fill a canonical gap, as the Disc is known to have a minor race of hairy forest dwellers, known as Kvetch - so why not use this template? If one does, from the descriptions available of Kvetch, one should probably add Odious Personal Habit (Complains A Lot).



...And that's about the lot for this thread. Actually running Discworld dungeon games, I'll leave to the GMs.
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