Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > The Fantasy Trip

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-24-2018, 03:17 PM   #1
Steve Jackson
President and EIC
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Default Attribute Adding Magic Items

The arguments against allowing these were cogent. So, giving it its own thread. Certainly it would be easy enough to delete a few lines and poof, attribute-adding magic items go away. Would be necessary to scour for references to them - whoops, did I have any in the Death Tests?

Does anyone want to present an argument in favor of KEEPING, e.g., the possibility of a+3 Ring of Dexterity?

Note that I am not suggesting we dispose of weapons with to-hit bonuses, nor do I want to remove the one-use potions.

Last edited by Steve Jackson; 06-24-2018 at 03:20 PM.
Steve Jackson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2018, 03:34 PM   #2
pyratejohn
 
pyratejohn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Columbia, Maryland
Default Re: Attribute Adding Magic Items

I’m fairly certain there was a sword in Death Test. I suspect most of my players (from my kids who up in their teens to my peers in their 50s) would find the lack of attribute adders odd, but the only argument I can think of off the top of my head is... tradition.

Was there a ring in DT2? Something in the back of my head is saying there was one somewhere in there...
__________________
Happily RPGing since 1976.
My Gaming and Reenacting Site (under construction)
pyratejohn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2018, 03:43 PM   #3
Jim Kane
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Default Re: Attribute Adding Magic Items

Again, my standard position on these matters is that things are fine they way that are *provided* a GM exercise control over how abundant, or not, (read: abused) these things are in his campaign.

Yet, at the same time - and more importantly - I feel people need to be allowed complete freedom to play the style of game they wish - and again, not have the style of game they can experience dictated by rules which govern too much for the designers' typewriter.

JK
Jim Kane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2018, 04:11 PM   #4
tomc
 
tomc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Carrboro, NC
Default Re: Attribute Adding Magic Items

I think attribute adders are fun.

Your character gets a (big?) instant boost they would otherwise have to wait weeks (months?) for. Fun and energizing for some.

It's a chance to see for yourself how the big boys roll.

You can also lose them, which is always dramatic.

You can build whole adventures around buying / stealing / recovering them.

Sure they can be "abused" if there are more in the game than the GM wants. But that's the GM's fault.
__________________
OgreMap2

Freedom of Speech is not Freedom of Podium
tomc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2018, 04:18 PM   #5
philreed
I do stuff and things.
 
philreed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Default Re: Attribute Adding Magic Items

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Jackson View Post
Does anyone want to present an argument in favor of KEEPING, e.g., the possibility of a+3 Ring of Dexterity?
It's an RPG touchstone for those familiar with classic fantasy roleplaying games, and a lot of fun when your character gets one.
philreed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2018, 04:26 PM   #6
JLV
 
JLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Arizona
Default Re: Attribute Adding Magic Items

I like them, and really think this is something more for the GM to decide for his/her game...and control.

And, I agree with Phil -- they are both a touchstone of fantasy RPGs and a heck of a lot of fun. (Besides which, they can be the source of many a scenario and plot-line. They're a perfect macguffin.)

At the end of the day, to me, this, or any, game is about fun.
JLV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2018, 08:02 PM   #7
Shostak
 
Shostak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: New England
Default Re: Attribute Adding Magic Items

My argument for keeping them is simply that magic is strange and mysterious and it can do wonderful things (if you are lucky). That should include a +3 Ring of Dexterity.
Shostak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2018, 08:10 PM   #8
Wayne
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Geelong, Australia
Default Re: Attribute Adding Magic Items

My vote (if I had one)?
I’d keep them in, they’re a standard part of fantasy rpgs, they’re in the first edition, and finally you can always make them very rare, expensive, or both.
Wayne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2018, 10:09 PM   #9
Rick_Smith
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Coquitlam B.C.
Default Re: Attribute Adding Magic Items

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne View Post
My vote (if I had one)?
I’d keep them in, they’re a standard part of fantasy rpgs, they’re in the first edition, and finally you can always make them very rare, expensive, or both.
Hi all, Steve.
I obviously have argued against them elsewhere. If you did want to keep them in, I would limit them to only helping a SUB-SET of the attribute's abilities.

Some examples:

-- Gloves of ST. This gives you more ST for wielding weapons, but does not raise your hit points, or give you more fatigue ST for spells.

-- Ring of Speed. You attack FASTER, but not more accurately. (So if your DX is 12, a +4 Ring of Speed means that you attack along with the DX 16 figures, but still need a 12 or less to hit.)

-- Glasses of Perception. You get a bonus to notice things (traps, hidden loot, am bushes, etc.).

-- Amulet of Endurance. You get more fatigue ST to power spells, or magic items, (or go for long runs) with.

I can think of several magic items in fiction (a belt that let the hero lift bars), but they generally were narrower in scope than the wide ranging TFT attributes.

Warm regards, Rick.

Last edited by Rick_Smith; 06-25-2018 at 12:01 PM.
Rick_Smith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2018, 11:22 PM   #10
Skarg
 
Join Date: May 2015
Default Re: Attribute Adding Magic Items

My suggestion would be to add a section on GMs choosing which magic spells & items exist in their campaigns, that gives some tips (especially for the benefit of new GMs (and GMs new to TFT)) about the impact of making available certain magic, or not.

The issue I see is that these items (attribute adders and several other types) can have a large impact on play, and the degree, nature and flavor of that that impact isn't always obvious (as I still vividly remember from GM'ing TFT as my first RPG campaign starting at age 11...).

Describing magics that many GMs may not want to include, at least gives the opportunity to specify how they would work in an interesting and hopefully somewhat balanced way. Such as Rick's suggestions above for having attribute adders be limited to some aspect of an attribute rather than increasing it for all purposes. And/or having a limit of how high they can raise an attribute. And/or, having it require 1 fatigue per turn. And/or adjusting the costs and/or ingredients required. Currently it's $2,000 for a +1 attribute adder, and that seemed like an absolute bargain (especially for people with high attributes and high EP requirements to raise them further). If high attributes are going to be harder to acquire and/or capped, ways to increase stats will be relatively more valuable.

(I don't think there is a magic item that increases attributes in Death Test or Death Test 2, but there are at least a couple that reduce attributes.)
Skarg is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:58 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.