Should Legality Class of TL+ weapons change?

[Jasonft]

Assume a fairly standard world setting of your choice, for the sake of this question we will assume one much like our own. Now add, by whatever means works for your campaign, weapons of a higher Tech Level.

An easy example is a laser of blaster pistol in this TL8 setting. They are rare, expensive, and have to be pretty much custom built by a Gadgeteer.

Question: Should the Legality Class of this obviously superior weapon be changed from that listed for when it occurs naturally at the proper TL? If so, how much?

Opinions anyone?

[Tomsdad]

I'd argue that since LC is referencing a social construct that has developed in an ongoing context and your talking about functionally an out of context problem, it's a bit moot.

Basically if you start running around in the modern day with working laser blaster, your problem is not going to be falling foul of what ever the local gun laws are, it going to be the government black bagging it and you for Military R&D.


Think of this way I live in the UK that means no pistols for me, but there are certain parts of the US where you can open or concealed carry an semi automatic pistol legally. Basically two very far apart situations in terms of gun control in the western world.


Thing is even in those parts of the US do we think the conversation will go "yes your honour, it does fire packets of super energised particles, but it does so once with each pull of the trigger thereby falling within the rules of gun regulation XXXXX"

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by Jasonft

Assume a fairly standard world setting of your choice, for the sake of this question we will assume one much like our own. Now add, by whatever means works for your campaign, weapons of a higher Tech Level.

An easy example is a laser of blaster pistol in this TL8 setting. They are rare, expensive, and have to be pretty much custom built by a Gadgeteer.

Question: Should the Legality Class of this obviously superior weapon be changed from that listed for when it occurs naturally at the proper TL? If so, how much?

Opinions anyone?

That depends on local politics. It certainly wouldn't be automatic that a weapon which is only superior in terms of number of shots required before "reloading" and armour penetration would be more restricted legally. But governments would want examples for reverse engineering.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Jasonft

Question: Should the Legality Class of this obviously superior weapon be changed from that listed for when it occurs naturally at the proper TL? If so, how much?

Typically such items will either not be addressed by laws at all, or be addressed by ridiculously inappropriate laws, so legality class is extremely uncertain.

[The Colonel]

Yeah, count me in for the "law doesn't matter, the state will steal it" consensus...

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by Tomsdad

Think of this way I live in the UK that means no pistols for me, but there are certain parts of the US where you can open or concealed carry an semi automatic pistol legally. "

46 or 47 out of 50 states is more than just "certain parts". It's the laws of a few large cities that are the anomaly rather than te norm.

However, firearms laws won't matter since a laser won't be a gun under US law. It will have no receiver and under US law it's the receiver that makes it a gun and is where the serial number has to go. It won't have barrel and it won't have ammunition which could be of illegal caliber or construction or several other things regulated about guns.

The applicable regulations would the ones applying to lasers. A weapons grade laser would need an output greater than 5 milliwatts (the limit for eye safety) so there would be some restrictions.

If all this is starting to sound arbitrary then I may have conveyed the real world situation accurately. Real world weapons laws are extremely arbitrary.

UT assignment of LCs tend to be arbitrary too. All sonic weapons start at LC 4 whether they are stunners or screamers. Force weapons that are potentially very lethal are LC4 also. Having laser pistols that are armor piercing, incendiary and full auto (and not eye safe)be LC3 isn't terribly logical either.

To sum up, I don't see anywhere where uniform logical principles are likely to be applied to the situation

[scc]

HT page 8 has some rules that will interest you

[Tomsdad]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

46 or 47 out of 50 states is more than just "certain parts". It's the laws of a few large cities that are the anomaly rather than te norm.

Quite, I didn't want to say "you can walk around with a gun openly in nearly all of the US" because someone would only come along and say "Well actually, I think you'll find....."

Either way, my point in referencing the range of gun control between the UK and US was that it will actually make little difference in this situation.

One caveat, it will only really kick in once there are witnesses to you actually using it.

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

However, firearms laws won't matter since a laser won't be a gun under US law. It will have no receiver and under US law it's the receiver that makes it a gun and is where the serial number has to go. It won't have barrel and it won't have ammunition which could be of illegal caliber or construction or several other things regulated about guns.

The applicable regulations would the ones applying to lasers. A weapons grade laser would need an output greater than 5 milliwatts (the limit for eye safety) so there would be some restrictions.

If all this is starting to sound arbitrary then I may have conveyed the real world situation accurately. Real world weapons laws are extremely arbitrary.

UT assignment of LCs tend to be arbitrary too. All sonic weapons start at LC 4 whether they are stunners or screamers. Force weapons that are potentially very lethal are LC4 also. Having laser pistols that are armor piercing, incendiary and full auto (and not eye safe)be LC3 isn't terribly logical either.

To sum up, I don't see anywhere where uniform logical principles are likely to be applied to the situation

yep I agree with this, it's basically a out of context problem which means a ruling would be made on the fly, and that's leaving aside the fact that there will be lots of very powerful groups who will be very interested in you and your 'gun'.

[Lord Azagthoth]

In the Netherlands, all fire-arms are licenced. Heavy fire-arms are forbidden (only available for military). Self producing weapons is licenced (even if it is a non-working or fantasy/SF weapon)

The technology for TL8 weapons is already there (industrial lasers, plasma). But the building of weapons with such technologies is equally forbidden. You could even be punnished if you use a low-intensity laser in public. I would classify them not with a higher LC but put them into the prototype category. If you make such a weapon and it doesn't look like a weapon it's even illegal (but harder to detect by law enforcement).

[scc]

Originally Posted by Tomsdad

Quite, I didn't want to say "you can walk around with a gun openly in nearly all of the US" because someone would only come along and say "Well actually, I think you'll find....."

I'd imagine that openly carrying a gun and not being a police officer, security guard or the like is a good way to have someone call the cops on you, regardless of whether or not it's legal, unless you're in an area that proscribes to the idea that carrying a gun is a good way to cut down on crime (This would make sense for RPG US, especially a wild west game, but not IRL)

And then there's the things that you like can't do whilst openly carry a gun, like enter banks, jewellery stores and the like. Crowded places like malls are also out.