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Old 06-09-2019, 07:19 AM   #21
maximara
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Default Re: [Basic] Frustrated by Tentacles

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Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl View Post
Sorry, but that is still +8 to grapples or four extra parries a turn or two shields and two two-handed weapons for 60 CP (assuming Extra Arm 4 (Extra-Flexible, +50%)). Extra Arms is well worth the points for the extra four parries and/or blocks per turn. This is especially useful when you consider that the character could use a polearm and four medium shield simultaneously.

One question that I would have though would be how much DB would four medium shields provide when wielded by four extra-flexible extra arms? Would it be +8 to all defenses? How would you deal with such a turtle, especially in a fantasy world?
Actually, "No matter how many arms you have, though, you do not get additional attacks (or other extra maneuvers) in combat unless you buy Extra Attacks (see below)." ... "You cannot punch with more than one arm at a time unless you have Extra Attack, but you may grapple with all of your arms at once." B53

So Extra Arm 4 without Extra Attacks (25 points/attack) would not give you any extra maneuvers which IIRC includes Block and parry. To get those with your Extra Arm 4 you would have to also get Extra Attacks 4 for 100 points.

Extra arms also grants you a +2 per arm to break free of a grapple.

Last edited by maximara; 06-09-2019 at 07:29 AM.
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Old 06-09-2019, 08:26 AM   #22
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Default Re: [Basic] Frustrated by Tentacles

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So Extra Arm 4 without Extra Attacks (25 points/attack) would not give you any extra maneuvers which IIRC includes Block and parry. To get those with your Extra Arm 4 you would have to also get Extra Attacks 4 for 100 points.
Default humans get one unpenalized* Parry per arm, even without Extra Attack, so I see no reason why Extra Arms shouldn't give you an additional unpenalized Parry per additional arm. You certainly do need Extra Attack (or use Multi-Weapon Attack) to attack with more than one limb, of course.

*Unpenalized aside from the off-hand penalty when applicable, that is.
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Old 06-09-2019, 10:07 AM   #23
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Default Re: [Basic] Frustrated by Tentacles

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Actually, "No matter how many arms you have, though, you do not get additional attacks (or other extra maneuvers) in combat unless you buy Extra Attacks (see below)." ... "You cannot punch with more than one arm at a time unless you have Extra Attack, but you may grapple with all of your arms at once." B53

So Extra Arm 4 without Extra Attacks (25 points/attack) would not give you any extra maneuvers which IIRC includes Block and parry. To get those with your Extra Arm 4 you would have to also get Extra Attacks 4 for 100 points.

Extra arms also grants you a +2 per arm to break free of a grapple.
I agree with Varyon. Normal human dual wielding a sword can parry once with each hand without penalty, I don't see why a being with an extra arm wouldn't also get similar benefit as part of the advantage. Of course, Attacking (or Waiting, Evaluating, Concentrating, Readying...) is a whole new territory that would require relevant advantages.
Similary, a human can start a grapple with both arms (in fact, that's the default), so an octopus with 8 "arms" should also be able to start a grapple with all of them. Again, it doesn't mean it could, say, use 7 tentacles to grapple and one to stab with a knife or something.
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Old 06-09-2019, 10:22 AM   #24
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Default Re: [Basic] Frustrated by Tentacles

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Default humans get one unpenalized* Parry per arm, even without Extra Attack, so I see no reason why Extra Arms shouldn't give you an additional unpenalized Parry per additional arm. You certainly do need Extra Attack (or use Multi-Weapon Attack) to attack with more than one limb, of course.

*Unpenalized aside from the off-hand penalty when applicable, that is.
But humans only have two arms (normally) so Extra arms granting extra Parries depends on if Parry counts as a Maneuvers and the Basic Set is a little vague on that point (other then the unready weapon)
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Old 06-09-2019, 10:35 AM   #25
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Default Re: [Basic] Frustrated by Tentacles

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But humans only have two arms (normally) so Extra arms granting extra Parries depends on if Parry counts as a Maneuvers and the Basic Set is a little vague on that point (other then the unready weapon)
Active defenses aren't Maneuvers; you choose a Maneuver on your turn. Active Defenses are reactions that some Maneuvers preclude (All-Out Attack, frex) or limit (Committed Attack).

This is, however, the sort of thing that makes one go "Hmmm." If the limit on parries is "how much can you wave your limbs around?" then parrying 50 times with 50 arms makes sense. If it's "how fast and how well coordinated can you perceive and respond to attacks," then EVERY additional parry should carry a burden of penalties. If you want "avoid 'em all, at once," then dodge.
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Old 06-09-2019, 11:08 AM   #26
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Default Re: [Basic] Frustrated by Tentacles

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Default humans get one unpenalized* Parry per arm...
Actually it's per weapon or bare hand (Basic pg 376), which as of Martial Arts also includes feet. MA, Parries with Legs or Feet pg 123, opens the 'two' up to 'three'.

The limit of 'three' is probably because they don't feel that quickly hopping from one foot to the other while leg parrying is realistic... I agree.


However, in my house games I allow "One Parry per limb before penalties accrue", but I also run cinematic games. So if someone wants to parry with two swords and both feet, go for it...
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Old 06-09-2019, 11:52 AM   #27
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Default Re: [Basic] Frustrated by Tentacles

My first thought:

Extra Arms 2 (Extra Flexible, +50%) [30]
Extra Arms 4 (Extra Flexible, +50%; Temporary Disadvantage: Ham Fisted, -5%) [58]

You have eight tentacles which can function in pairs with similar dexterity as four normal arms. If used singularly, they have -3 to DX.

Not sure what "spliting up some pairs leaves the others fully dexterous" should be valued at. A perk at most.
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Old 06-09-2019, 12:07 PM   #28
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Default Re: [Basic] Frustrated by Tentacles

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Active defenses aren't Maneuvers; you choose a Maneuver on your turn. Active Defenses are reactions that some Maneuvers preclude (All-Out Attack, frex) or limit (Committed Attack).
Except All-Out Defense is a Maneuver (B324) hence my comment.
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Old 06-09-2019, 12:32 PM   #29
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Default Re: [Basic] Frustrated by Tentacles

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Except All-Out Defense is a Maneuver (B324) hence my comment.
All Out Defense is a maneuver, but it isn't in any respect an active defense. There's no vagueness about the relationship between maneuvers and active defenses.
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Old 06-09-2019, 01:48 PM   #30
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Default Re: [Basic] Frustrated by Tentacles

Yes, the rules are fairly clear, you get one parry/block per weapon/shield, and you can normally carry one weapon/shield per arm (strikers also normally count as a weapon, so they normally add to the parry count). A creature with 100 arms/stickers could parry 100 times a turn without penalty, though I am sure that there is diminishing returns after 10 parris per turn.
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