Gurps Vampire vs Hunter balance concerns.

Boge · 11-14-2017, 05:42 PM

I did some searches and see that the old vampire books haven't been converted to 4e (correct me if I'm wrong as I don't own them).

My group is playing a vampire gurps coming up. I hate vampire stuff and don't want to play as one. I'm concerned how this is going to cripple me when I'm up against a vampire that boosts his/her stats to kick my butt and how it's best balanced with me not being one.

About what point character would you guess would be appropriate for a well trained hunter in order to balance up with newbie vampires? Are there any updated conversions we could go with? The only thing I find is http://www.finestead.com/wod/, but the site is dead.

Phantasm · 11-14-2017, 06:08 PM

There are no and probably never will be any official World of Darkness conversions to GURPS 4e, due to licencing.

That said, a hunter built on the same number of points as a vampire will probably be a combat terror. I highly recommend looking at the Monster Hunters line. My own pure human vampire hunter fought smart, using a mix of the vampire weaknesses and (Path/Book) magic to even the odds. (I still had to find IC excuses to NOT stake the rest of the party, though, which was helped somewhat by the vamp PCs not feeding near my char....)

sir_pudding · 11-14-2017, 06:19 PM

The license isn't likely to be be made available again for a conversion, probably ever.

Honestly if you really don't like vampires you probably are better not playing, since a VtM game is really about them and if you don't care about what they are doing then you likely won't have fun.

That said characters of equal points are supposed to be representitive of equal power, so in theory you could make a character that is the same value as the other PCs, in practice though supernatural abilities can be very effective for their costs if you don't have countermeasures and you may also just have trouble spending that many points on mundane stuff that makes sense, unless you want to be a super strong, super wealthy, super athletic, super genius with omnicompetence in every skill, that just happens to be some vampire's butler or whatever (or worse if they are Sabbat). You might consider adapting some of the abilities from Hunter: The Reckoning.

Dragondog · 11-14-2017, 06:21 PM

How many points your character will be, will be as many as your GM gives you. Monster Hunters will be a good source of how to build such hunters.

If the campaign mechanics for 4e haven't been set yet, your GM may find https://diceandlives.wordpress.com/2...rst-blog-post/ useful.

Boge · 11-14-2017, 07:08 PM

The issue is a couple of our group wants to play vampire. I don't, but it's not my choice at this time. So I either don't play, which causes the group to not play, or I suck it up and try to enjoy it how I can. I do not want to play as a vampire though, so the GM has said I could have some sort of immunity to vampirism.

We don't really do PvP though, so there shouldn't be much of that, but it doesn't change that I want to be on par with the other players powers, not necessarily for combat, but as a vampire hunter, that's mostly my character's specialty. So I'm just trying to figure out what would be balanced. I don't really understand the abilities of vampires. I did play once before and the players were just boosting their skills and became super human in combat with stuff like 20 ST and 15 move/dodge.

I'm trying to get an idea on how I can tip the scales so my character can compete against a vampire.

The other players will probably be average humans who end up becoming vampires in a couple of sessions. So whatever power-wise that would be, I feel my character needs to be comparable. I asked the GM what point value I should go with. He said 200. I don't know if the other players will start at that as well or lower.

Oh, it's set in the 1690s as well, so I wouldn't have much in the way of technology to help me out.

Purple Haze · 11-14-2017, 07:27 PM

It is well over twenty years since I have had any experience with VtM. But I seem to recall that there was some sort of "pure of heart" power that negated all vampiric powers used near or against the character.

sir_pudding · 11-14-2017, 07:27 PM

So let's say they are neonates in the Camarilla. They will be inducted into the political structure of the local Camarilla which you are excluded from, they will attend meetings that you will not only be unable to attend they will be forbidden to tell you about, they will interact with NPCs that will never deign to speak with you, and they will need to spend a fair amount of time and effort just on survival as kindred, especially since they are neonates and can't have herds yet or even really know what they are doing. During the day they will be dead, and you will still, presumably need to sleep, so you can either do stuff for them during the day solo, or sleep during the day and join the party at night. There will be an incredible amount of pressure on them to ghoul you, because most kindred will see you as a liability or threat otherwise. Once they learn the basics and survive, they may eventually get missions suitable for neonates, for which they might be able to use you.

Honestly, as GM, I would be very concerned that you aren't going to have much fun. I would suggest considering playing a bloodline that doesn't feel much like a traditional vampire, like a gargoyle, instead.

sir_pudding · 11-14-2017, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Purple Haze

It is well over twenty years since I have had any experience with VtM. But I seem to recall that there was some sort of "pure of heart" power that negated all vampiric powers used near or against the character.

True Faith was not remotely that useful unfortunately.

Boge · 11-14-2017, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

So let's say they are neonates in the Camarilla. They will be inducted into the political structure of the local Camarilla which you are excluded from, they will attend meetings that you will not only be unable to attend they will be forbidden to tell you about, they will interact with NPCs that will never deign to speak with you, and they will need to spend a fair amount of time and effort just on survival as kindred, especially since they are neonates and can't have herds yet or even really know what they are doing. During the day they will be dead, and you will still, presumably need to sleep, so you can either do stuff for them during the day solo, or sleep during the day and join the party at night. There will be an incredible amount of pressure on them to ghoul you, because most kindred will see you as a liability or threat otherwise. Once they learn the basics and survive, they may eventually get missions suitable for neonates, for which they might be able to use you.

Honestly, as GM, I would be very concerned that you aren't going to have much fun. I would suggest considering playing a bloodline that doesn't feel much like a traditional vampire, like a gargoyle, instead.

I really don't know what you just said. The GM is aware I probably won't be having any fun, but there are 5 of us and not all 5 of us are ever completely happy with any type of gurps we play. So we're trying a rotation system where we each pick one. To start, it's going to be a vampire Gurps. I just have to deal with it. I just figure being a vampire hunter would be the most enjoyable to me than being a freak. I'm just not sure how I can be competitive. He'll likely give me some special items that grant bonuses. I guess I should just count on that.

Flyndaran · 11-14-2017, 07:49 PM

Couldn't you make a vampire that hates being a vampire? Trying to find a cure, and hating other vampires?
You can still be a vampire hunting vampires too.

11-14-2017, 05:42 PM	#1
Boge Join Date: Jul 2015	Gurps Vampire vs Hunter balance concerns. I did some searches and see that the old vampire books haven't been converted to 4e (correct me if I'm wrong as I don't own them). My group is playing a vampire gurps coming up. I hate vampire stuff and don't want to play as one. I'm concerned how this is going to cripple me when I'm up against a vampire that boosts his/her stats to kick my butt and how it's best balanced with me not being one. About what point character would you guess would be appropriate for a well trained hunter in order to balance up with newbie vampires? Are there any updated conversions we could go with? The only thing I find is http://www.finestead.com/wod/, but the site is dead.

11-14-2017, 06:08 PM	#2
Phantasm Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: On the road again...	Re: Gurps Vampire vs Hunter balance concerns. There are no and probably never will be any official World of Darkness conversions to GURPS 4e, due to licencing. That said, a hunter built on the same number of points as a vampire will probably be a combat terror. I highly recommend looking at the Monster Hunters line. My own pure human vampire hunter fought smart, using a mix of the vampire weaknesses and (Path/Book) magic to even the odds. (I still had to find IC excuses to NOT stake the rest of the party, though, which was helped somewhat by the vamp PCs not feeding near my char....) __________________ "Life ... is an Oreo cookie." - J'onn J'onzz, 1991 "But mom, I don't wanna go back in the dungeon!" The GURPS Marvel Universe Reboot Project A-G, H-R, and S-Z, and its not-a-wiki-really web adaptation. Ranoc, a Muskets-and-Magery Renaissance Fantasy Setting Last edited by Phantasm; 11-30-2017 at 01:31 AM.

11-14-2017, 06:19 PM	#3
sir_pudding Wielder of Smart Pants Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Ventura CA	Re: Gurps Vampire vs Hunter balance concerns. The license isn't likely to be be made available again for a conversion, probably ever. Honestly if you really don't like vampires you probably are better not playing, since a VtM game is really about them and if you don't care about what they are doing then you likely won't have fun. That said characters of equal points are supposed to be representitive of equal power, so in theory you could make a character that is the same value as the other PCs, in practice though supernatural abilities can be very effective for their costs if you don't have countermeasures and you may also just have trouble spending that many points on mundane stuff that makes sense, unless you want to be a super strong, super wealthy, super athletic, super genius with omnicompetence in every skill, that just happens to be some vampire's butler or whatever (or worse if they are Sabbat). You might consider adapting some of the abilities from Hunter: The Reckoning. Last edited by sir_pudding; 11-20-2017 at 12:26 PM. Reason: I had NWod and OWoD backwards in re hunters.

11-14-2017, 06:21 PM	#4
Dragondog Never Been Pretty Join Date: Jan 2005	Re: Gurps Vampire vs Hunter balance concerns. How many points your character will be, will be as many as your GM gives you. Monster Hunters will be a good source of how to build such hunters. If the campaign mechanics for 4e haven't been set yet, your GM may find https://diceandlives.wordpress.com/2...rst-blog-post/ useful. __________________ Daydreams of a Dragon: My blog

11-14-2017, 07:08 PM	#5
Boge Join Date: Jul 2015	Re: Gurps Vampire vs Hunter balance concerns. The issue is a couple of our group wants to play vampire. I don't, but it's not my choice at this time. So I either don't play, which causes the group to not play, or I suck it up and try to enjoy it how I can. I do not want to play as a vampire though, so the GM has said I could have some sort of immunity to vampirism. We don't really do PvP though, so there shouldn't be much of that, but it doesn't change that I want to be on par with the other players powers, not necessarily for combat, but as a vampire hunter, that's mostly my character's specialty. So I'm just trying to figure out what would be balanced. I don't really understand the abilities of vampires. I did play once before and the players were just boosting their skills and became super human in combat with stuff like 20 ST and 15 move/dodge. I'm trying to get an idea on how I can tip the scales so my character can compete against a vampire. The other players will probably be average humans who end up becoming vampires in a couple of sessions. So whatever power-wise that would be, I feel my character needs to be comparable. I asked the GM what point value I should go with. He said 200. I don't know if the other players will start at that as well or lower. Oh, it's set in the 1690s as well, so I wouldn't have much in the way of technology to help me out. Last edited by Boge; 11-14-2017 at 07:26 PM.

11-14-2017, 07:27 PM	#6
Purple Haze Join Date: Jul 2006	Re: Gurps Vampire vs Hunter balance concerns. It is well over twenty years since I have had any experience with VtM. But I seem to recall that there was some sort of "pure of heart" power that negated all vampiric powers used near or against the character.

11-14-2017, 07:49 PM	#10
Flyndaran Untagged Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon	Re: Gurps Vampire vs Hunter balance concerns. Couldn't you make a vampire that hates being a vampire? Trying to find a cure, and hating other vampires? You can still be a vampire hunting vampires too. __________________ Beware, poor communication skills. No offense intended. If offended, it just means that I failed my writing skill check.