12-10-2005, 04:01 PM | #11 | |
Wielder of Smart Pants
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
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Re: Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games
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12-10-2005, 04:17 PM | #12 | |
Dog of Lysdexics
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Melbourne FL, Formerly Wellington NZ
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Re: Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games
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12-10-2005, 04:20 PM | #13 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games
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12-10-2005, 06:01 PM | #14 | ||
Wielder of Smart Pants
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
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Re: Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games
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12-10-2005, 08:03 PM | #15 | |
Dog of Lysdexics
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Melbourne FL, Formerly Wellington NZ
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Re: Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games
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12-10-2005, 08:58 PM | #16 |
Banned
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Norfolk, VA
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Re: Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games
I could go on. More spending money, a cooler and ultra-recognizable name, simpler rules, books that look fancier, monopolization due to the OGL, you name it -- D&D has all the advantages. Too bad its poor cousin, GURPS, is sexier and a lot more talented. ;) As GMs grow older and more experienced, they want something more than what D&D can offer, which in truth isn't all that much (in my opinion). |
12-10-2005, 09:27 PM | #17 | |
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Video games destroyed my life. Good that I have 2 extra lives!
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Re: Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games
Actually, his point was that most people are relatively ignorant of the topic, as it's not very mainstream. D&D (and later EQ and WOW mmorpgs) are the closest roleplaying has gotten to mainstream culture (also comic books, choose-yer own adventure type books, fantasy novels (some critically acclaimed) television cartoons, and a small number of name-brand and non-name brand genre-type movies). So the average person, makes the connection with what has already partially integrated into the mainstream. It's not exactly an A : A:: A logical arguement. It's the burden of advertising and finding customers.
D&D reached relative "massiveness" (probably not up there with rap music/50 cent, or even MTV in general) by reaching out to the mass market thru the bookstores (and thru the niche market: conventions) for ~30 years. GURPS started out as/is a mailorder game that lived by word of mouth at conventions/private games, and now also the internet. D&D/TSR/WoTC was smart. Not only did they successfully reinvent the product as it was dying (2ed was losing popularity and profitability), they also took a profit hit (semi-releasing D&D to the public domain as D20), which paid off with all the D20 spin-offs with have to pay homage to D&D v.3x. All the D20 stuff is free advertising for the original D20 authors, and broadens the market for D20-based games. Figure that D&D was reinvented intelligently too, towards what people like: collectibility, comic book flash, competitive munchkinism. Stuff probably most GURPS people don't like to pay for in rpg's, or don't even like. GURPS is still going/developing high quality, rather than go the quantity/spin-offs route (like Oscar movies vs. "hit" television sitcoms). What if GURPS did a pseudo-D20 thing? They couldn't do it exactly since that would cripple the income. But they could for instance create a secondary label, such as GURPS-Lite, in which derivative works of it would be semi-public domain/shared copyright so it wouldn't have to be screened, controlled, and contracted with SJ Games. Probably wouldn't work, do to too much uncontrolled competition with GURPS and GURPS-lite; But main benefit would be to increase free-lancing (free talent-scouting), and maybe point out to SJ Games some working topics to develop GURPS around with out having to invest capital in the research itself. Alternative route: Get Gurps name-brand recognition for use in other projects like computer RPGs/MMORPGS. Or get GURPS linked to popular cross-over projects---like maybe an Infinite Worlds/Transhuman space comic book, or a special Games Workshop---GURPS-approved miniatures (probably more liekly with a more down to earth company like Reaper or Old Glory), or published fiction based on GURPS concepts/worlds. Actually Games-Workshop partially rose to fame doing all this stuff. Maybe limited edition, full service multimedia boxed sets for GURPS---GM screens, miniatures, dice, DVD's, software play aids, each on a particular genre/theme? Quote:
Last edited by GoodGame; 12-10-2005 at 09:40 PM. |
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12-11-2005, 05:08 AM | #18 |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Columbia, Maryland
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Re: Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games
I believe one of the reasons my players like D&D is because in D&D character advancement is more visible. A D&D character starts life as a weakling, and fights his way to increasing levels of power. This advancement is noticeable and gives the players a sense of achievement. In GURPS, a character begins life as larger than life. Advancement comes slowly. The players feel as if they've gotten few "rewards" for play.
With that in mind, I could give my players more points after a GURPS play session. Though I don't know if it would even matter. My players don't even seem to care about advancing their characters when playing GURPS. Is that weird? Oh! One other thing just came to mind! If I had been involved in GURPS 4th edition playtesting, I would've made a suggestion for one big change - increase the point values by a factor of 100! Why? The psychology of more is better. Which do you think appeals to more people, a 100 point character, or a 10,000 point character? Just some thoughts... Your mileage will vary. |
12-11-2005, 07:20 AM | #19 |
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Oslo, Norway
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Re: Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games
I think that settings that provide a recognizable and shared imaginary space -whether provided by licenses or not - are very important. The following anecdote is meant to corroborate this:
Yesterday, I ran GURPS for the first time with three friends previously unfamiliar with the system. Of these, one, female, 26, had tried a couple of uninspired D&D sessions, and found this rather unappealing. One, male, 26, has played and plays a lot of D&D, and is also the manager of Friendly Local Gaming Store. The third, male, 25, has played quite a bit of D&D and WoD. It had taken some persuasion to get them to give GURPS a shot. Promising to run a GURPS Discworld adventure helped a lot. My SO also played. I spent 15-20 minutes explaining the rules to the players, focusing on the different attributes found on their character sheets, and the relative deadliness of the combat system. Then we were off on Hogwatchnight patrol (I had updated the characters and adventure to 4th edition, substituted Dungeonsnaps for Burfies, and made the whole thing a little less linear). We played continuously for 5 hours, laughing all the while, and I think this may be one of the best sessions I have ever run. The female had her interest in role-playing games revived, and the FLGS manager remarked that GURPS seemed far better than he had been led to believe by the comments of various D&D enthusiasts.
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12-11-2005, 08:16 AM | #20 | |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
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Re: Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games
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GURPS Discworld sounds pretty much ideal for that sort of recruitment. I don't set out to recruit people to specific rules systems; the rules system is one of the last things I decide on when I'm working up a campaign concept for a prospectus. I'm willing to run any rules system that looks suitable to the campaign concept. Fortunately I have players who don't have system loyalty. |
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