Gurps Vampire vs Hunter balance concerns.

[Boge]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

Unlikely if they stick to purely mundane and non-cinematic traits, which I think is the intent?

If you mean 4e cinematic abilities, yeah, for the most part they will be the basic book with probably very little cinematic abilities allowed. I could probably convince the GM to let me use some stuff though. But even though he's been GMing a long time, his group has been reluctant to adapt much outside of the basic books.

From some emails I got from one of the "vampire" PCs today,"changes in both the point values and the abilities." It sounds like the GM has done some adjustments. I still just don't have faith that he's looked at EVERYTHING and there will be a significant imbalance between me and them.

Oh well. I guess I'll just have to live with being underpowered. It's my choice to not be a freak afterall. Hope for the best.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Boge

If you mean 4e cinematic abilities, yeah, for the most part they will be the basic book with probably very little cinematic abilities allowed. I could probably convince the GM to let me use some stuff though. But even though he's been GMing a long time, his group has been reluctant to adapt much outside of the basic books..

I meant that I understood that don't want to play a character with any kind of unusual abilities. Was that incorrect?

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by Boge

If you mean 4e cinematic abilities, yeah, for the most part they will be the basic book with probably very little cinematic abilities allowed. I could probably convince the GM to let me use some stuff though. But even though he's been GMing a long time, his group has been reluctant to adapt much outside of the basic books.

From some emails I got from one of the "vampire" PCs today,"changes in both the point values and the abilities." It sounds like the GM has done some adjustments. I still just don't have faith that he's looked at EVERYTHING and there will be a significant imbalance between me and them.

Oh well. I guess I'll just have to live with being underpowered. It's my choice to not be a freak afterall. Hope for the best.

Well if Cinematic are likely off the table, how about Psychic or Supernatural? Seems fitting in a world of Vampires, even more for WoD.
Mind Shield will help a LOT vs. Influence and some Auspex abilities.
If not just get some Strong Will, Luck if allowed, and Research so you can quickly learn whatever info is available.
Also you know the other players. Will they liekly be investiagors? Being a good one can make you useful even with most of thier abilities.

[AlexanderHowl]

In WoD, mortals have access to Numina, which includes Chi, Divine, Magic, and Psi if you are using Powers (Nature and Spirit also exists, but that is more for Werewolves and the like rather than mortals).

[Boge]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

I meant that I understood that don't want to play a character with any kind of unusual abilities. Was that incorrect?

Powers. I'm not into supernatural stuff.

[dataweaver]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

You might as well be an NPC at that point. I don't see any point in actually showing up to game sessions if everything you do is downtime.

Obviously. Which is why just a little bit of common sense should indicate that that's not what I was suggesting. Obviously, not everything that this mortal character does will downtime; certainly, none of the roleplaying will be. I was merely pointing out that the mortal will have more time to work with than the vampires will, because his sleep schedule isn't locked to the sun.

My main thought here, though, is in my signature: point balance is a myth. This is especially true when dealing with game system conversions, which is why I'm bringing it up here. In particular, the OP wants to play a mortal (specifically, a mortal without supernatural abilities) in a game where the other PCs are vampires. This is doable; but you're not going to succeed by treating it as a point accounting problem. The issue here isn't the point disparity between the mortal and the vampires; it's that the vampires have supernatural traits and the mortal doesn't.

This makes it more of a “Batman and the Justice League” or “Lois and Clark” type of situation; and the solution is similar: find a niche for your mortal, something that he contributes that the others don't or can't. It doesn't matter if he's built on 300 points and everyone else is built on twice that or more; as long as there's an area where he can shine, you'll be fine.

[Railstar]

Originally Posted by dataweaver

This makes it more of a “Batman and the Justice League” or “Lois and Clark” type of situation; and the solution is similar: find a niche for your mortal, something that he contributes that the others don't or can't. It doesn't matter if he's built on 300 points and everyone else is built on twice that or more; as long as there's an area where he can shine, you'll be fine.

And a niche that reasonably fits with what the rest of the group does. I ran into a similar problem when a paladin-themed compassionate knight and a pacifist con-artist started working together. Their niches were so incompatible that they had a hard time involving both characters in the same scenes, because the pacifist couldn't handle combat at all, and the knight couldn't participate in the trickery at all. It essentially made them too separate from each other for convenient play.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by dataweaver

Obviously. Which is why just a little bit of common sense should indicate that that's not what I was suggesting. Obviously, not everything that this mortal character does will downtime; certainly, none of the roleplaying will be. I was merely pointing out that the mortal will have more time to work with than the vampires will, because his sleep schedule isn't locked to the sun.

My main thought here, though, is in my signature: point balance is a myth. This is especially true when dealing with game system conversions, which is why I'm bringing it up here. In particular, the OP wants to play a mortal (specifically, a mortal without supernatural abilities) in a game where the other PCs are vampires. This is doable; but you're not going to succeed by treating it as a point accounting problem. The issue here isn't the point disparity between the mortal and the vampires; it's that the vampires have supernatural traits and the mortal doesn't.

This makes it more of a “Batman and the Justice League” or “Lois and Clark” type of situation; and the solution is similar: find a niche for your mortal, something that he contributes that the others don't or can't. It doesn't matter if he's built on 300 points and everyone else is built on twice that or more; as long as there's an area where he can shine, you'll be fine.

I don't think the problem is point balance. The problem is that the player isn't interested in anything that is happening in the campaign. They don't care about kindred politics, and they don't care if the other PCs survive (in fact the only thing that is stopping them from actively making sure they don't is entirely meta). They want to make a character that has nothing to do with the "onscreen" part of the game, so doing the downtime stuff would make them more relevant, but they might as well not show up.

Edit: The problem isn't that they want to play Bruce Wayne or Lois Lane, the problem is that they want to play Lex Luthor or Slade Wilson.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Boge

Powers. I'm not into supernatural stuff.

Okay that eliminates sorcery, magick, psi, true faith, kinfolk, ghouls, and anything like that.

[JoelSammallahti]

For what it's worth, I'd identify and focus on a niche that the other player characters aren't involved in, and then sink a load of points into Luck. That way, you don't outshine supernatural monsters in their shtick (as you might if you just made a low-superhero-level combat specialist) but you're useful in your own area of expertise, and able to participate in all kinds of risky situations secured by frequent rerolls. Oh yeah, and buy Will 16, so you always have at least a 50% chance of resisting those guys who'll spam Dominate and Presence.