Super Easy Divine Magic Rules

[MikMod]

<tongue-in-cheek list>

:)

Though actually this has made me think about why I am very happy with magical creatures and less happy with magic items and spells.

I think the reason is that I want the players to have challenge in a magical world without becoming uber-powerful themselves. I feel that spells and especially items can quickly unbalance the game, or create a magical arms race - whereas a magical creature simply isn't open to that kind of abuse by the PCs: it has a brain of its own and cannot be 'owned' in the same way...

Plus they provide opportunities for role play which a +1 sword kinda doesn't! :)

[zot]

Originally Posted by MikMod

:)

Though actually this has made me think about why I am very happy with magical creatures and less happy with magic items and spells.

I think the reason is that I want the players to have challenge in a magical world without becoming uber-powerful themselves. I feel that spells and especially items can quickly unbalance the game, or create a magical arms race - whereas a magical creature simply isn't open to that kind of abuse by the PCs: it has a brain of its own and cannot be 'owned' in the same way...

Plus they provide opportunities for role play which a +1 sword kinda doesn't! :)

That sounds to me like sword and sorcery vs. high fantasy.

In my opinion, any setting that has market prices for magic items and hourly rates for spell casting is high fantasy :).

Blades and Black Magic is supposed to be for sword and sorcery. The book on magic, the second half of the rules, isn't out just yet though.

[MikMod]

Originally Posted by zot

That sounds to me like sword and sorcery vs. high fantasy.

In my opinion, any setting that has market prices for magic items and hourly rates for spell casting is high fantasy :).

Blades and Black Magic is supposed to be for sword and sorcery. The book on magic, the second half of the rules, isn't out just yet though.

I don't really understand the distinction. And I really don't want to change game systems if that's ok. I find TFT to be extremely adaptable. I just don't have magic shops in every village and a wizard for hire on every street corner. I'm sure I can't be the only one!

[Skarg]

You're not alone.

Just because there are rules for what it takes to make a magic item, and theoretical base prices listed for them, doesn't mean that there will be many or even any people selling or even making magic items in any campaign.

Whenever I think it through, it seems pretty unlikely to me that there would be much if any magic items available for sale to random adventurer types, at least not for list prices. Of the few wizards who can make them or people who have them and are willing to sell, an auction seems like the way to go, and the rich & powerful would no doubt tend to have their agents show up to and compete for those (and also take note of who else bought any interesting items). And selling to an aristocrat is probably worth more to a wizard or guild than selling to a random person who may be a loose cannon type.

[MikMod]

Originally Posted by Skarg

You're not alone.

Just because there are rules for what it takes to make a magic item, and theoretical base prices listed for them, doesn't mean that there will be many or even any people selling or even making magic items in any campaign.

Whenever I think it through, it seems pretty unlikely to me that there would be much if any magic items available for sale to random adventurer types, at least not for list prices. Of the few wizards who can make them or people who have them and are willing to sell, an auction seems like the way to go, and the rich & powerful would no doubt tend to have their agents show up to and compete for those (and also take note of who else bought any interesting items). And selling to an aristocrat is probably worth more to a wizard or guild than selling to a random person who may be a loose cannon type.

I agree. I'm thinking most people making magic items, fine weapons etc will be working on commissions most of the time rather than randomly cranking out an item (over literally months) in the hopes someone will want it. Any magical 'stock' is likely to be limited to extremely basic items and +1 swords, probably test pieces made by apprentices. So buying a magic item will involve identifying a wizard capable of making it, contacting them, currying favor, persuading them to take your commission, waiting for a slot in their schedule, paying up front, and then waiting for months while hoping your piece doesn't get bumped by someone else with more cash. I take the list prices as an absolute minimum. Wizards are smart - they will charge whatever anyone is willing to pay, so with any rich people about those prices will rocket, for all customers.

[Shoug]

Originally Posted by Skarg

You're not alone.

Just because there are rules for what it takes to make a magic item, and theoretical base prices listed for them, doesn't mean that there will be many or even any people selling or even making magic items in any campaign.

Whenever I think it through, it seems pretty unlikely to me that there would be much if any magic items available for sale to random adventurer types, at least not for list prices. Of the few wizards who can make them or people who have them and are willing to sell, an auction seems like the way to go, and the rich & powerful would no doubt tend to have their agents show up to and compete for those (and also take note of who else bought any interesting items). And selling to an aristocrat is probably worth more to a wizard or guild than selling to a random person who may be a loose cannon type.

In my setting, there is a place called the Long West. There is a meridian circumventing the globe where there is the edge of a desert. A whole third of the globe, theoretically, is encompassed by this desert. If you walk into it and lose sight of anything but the dunes, when you turn back from whence you came, there will only be dunes. When you are in the Long West, the sun never moves from high noon, the wind never blows, and you never find anything but sand. People who walk into the Long West disappear almost immediately, rarely ever to be seen again. Sometimes, however, when the astrological conditions are just right, the city Mirage can be seen looming distantly within the Long West. If you go into the Long West, and your eyes ever leave Mirage, it will disappear.

It is in the bazaars of Mirage where you can find any magical item.

[Skarg]

Originally Posted by MikMod

I'm thinking most people making magic items, fine weapons etc will be working on commissions most of the time rather than randomly cranking out an item (over literally months) in the hopes someone will want it. Any magical 'stock' is likely to be limited to extremely basic items and +1 swords, probably test pieces made by apprentices. So buying a magic item will involve identifying a wizard capable of making it, contacting them, currying favor, persuading them to take your commission, waiting for a slot in their schedule, paying up front, and then waiting for months while hoping your piece doesn't get bumped by someone else with more cash. I take the list prices as an absolute minimum. Wizards are smart - they will charge whatever anyone is willing to pay, so with any rich people about those prices will rocket, for all customers.

Exactly (though depending on place, I'm more generous about Master Armorers).

[JLV]

Originally Posted by Tywyll

Response Part 1

-snip-

Originally Posted by Tywyll

Response Part 2

-snip-

Why does this exchange forcibly put me in mind of National Lampoon's Bored of the Rings? ;-)

[JLV]

Originally Posted by MikMod

I don't really understand the distinction. And I really don't want to change game systems if that's ok. I find TFT to be extremely adaptable. I just don't have magic shops in every village and a wizard for hire on every street corner. I'm sure I can't be the only one!

The distinction mostly comes down to how much magic the players have direct access to, I think. Other than that it's more of an argument over "how many angels can dance on the head of a pin."

I've always been a "high fantasy" guy up until I ran across a splat book published for HOW (Raedwald) which was totally brilliant and actually intrigued me enough to start looking at "low fantasy" (or "Swords & Sorcery;" that Conan type stuff) as possibly very interesting to play. I even started reading some of the fiction, even though, for the past 50 years, I'd dismissed it as unworthy of my time...

Oh, and BTW, if you don't want to learn a new system, you're in luck -- Blades & Black Magic is very TFT-ish (in fact, it more closely resembles what I was originally hoping for from Legacy Edition, personally) and well worth a look at.

[MikMod]

Originally Posted by JLV

Raedwald was totally brilliant and actually intrigued me enough to start looking at "low fantasy" (or "Swords & Sorcery;" that Conan type stuff)

I think I started with Conan, Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser, and stuff like Tanith Lee. I read LOTR and the Hobbit, but I liked that the viewpoint was usually from someone small and barely significant in a world of giants and overwhelming horrors. On the other hand, I love Anhk-Morpork and that's soaked in magic. I didn't know there were 'two kinds of fantasy' and that they 'have names' until a few days ago! So I'm not very familiar with the distinctions :)

Oh, and BTW, if you don't want to learn a new system, you're in luck -- Blades & Black Magic is very TFT-ish (in fact, it more closely resembles what I was originally hoping for from Legacy Edition, personally) and well worth a look at.

Argh! Another system... Grrr. Thank you for recommending it - I don't know if I will buy it on spec, without a magic system though. I've just spent the last day deep diving into Fate - which has got my mind whirring all on its own!