02-17-2010, 06:31 AM | #41 |
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Re: Witchcraft and Swashbuckling
Yep, syncretism was sort of popular at one time - a lot of the resulting practises were cleaned out in the reformation, but there's a lot of distinctly dubious hagiography out there, and Christmas is at the wrong time of year for a reason. That goes double for the ignoblis ritae in a some Romanist countries - the local saint's festival is all too often a pagan rite with a thin coat of Christian paint. And come to think of it, the Anglicans get up to some old stuff as well ... beating the bounds, for example, ain't Biblical, but is a re-working of much older rituals.
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02-17-2010, 08:10 AM | #42 |
Join Date: Sep 2008
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Re: Witchcraft and Swashbuckling
Of course not, but witches are generally depicted as either pagan (in a "witches aren't evil" setting) or as worshiping Satan (in a "witches are evil" setting). My point was that the accusations of witchcraft in the setting are unfounded in anything other than greed for money and power.
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Quos deus vult perdere, prius dementat. Latin: Those whom a god wishes to destroy, he first drives mad. |
02-17-2010, 08:37 AM | #43 | |
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: The armpit of the Icegiant, Sweden
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Re: Witchcraft and Swashbuckling
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Nvm that I'd like to see more "Christian" witches in games - as in "Waddyamean it is wrong to cure people using magic? I invoke the Trinity every time I do!", because that seems to have been fairly common and is pretty gameable. Mix with Hammer Horror Satanists and neo-pagan romanticism to your pleasure... Erik |
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02-17-2010, 09:00 AM | #44 | |
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: The armpit of the Icegiant, Sweden
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Re: Witchcraft and Swashbuckling
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People accused of magic who actually had practiced it was often ''incensed'' at the thought of being in league with the Devil or something like that. Recorded spells and charms often invoke the Trinity, making the cross a certain number of time, using "holy items" (lead taken from church windows is good for bullets to hit Nasty Things with, for instance), etc. Some of them can be shown to be tranlations of older charms which might have been pagan, but many of them first passed through a phase when they kept invoking saints, to the great irritance of the fanatically Lutheran authorities, as mentioned earlier in this thread. Black magic as such was thought of as, naturally, criminal, and nothing people normally thought of doing (although there are things as actual "satanic contracts" and curse-dolls that has been preserved). Accusations of black magic was generally not targeted at "wise women" or "cunning men" but simply at people who seemed very prosperous, which nobody liked, and which had no better connections to defend themselves. Likewise, strangers - such as those Sami (Lapps) which lived south of their old lands and worked as tinkerers and butchers - were suspected of black magic. (The Sami speciality is being werewolves, for those keeping score at home. They laid the same accusation at the Swedish settlers up north...) Another group, coming back to the subject, that was thought of as witches were many priests. The legend goes that certain ministers in the Church of Sweden got special education in sorcery gained from the Sixth and Seventh Book of Moses, two secret parts of the Pentateuch. Some sorcerer-priests were thought to be standard witches (cursing people and so forth, with black ravens gathering to take their souls to Hell when they die) while others actually seem pretty heroic: their magic is concerned with things like finding thieves, calming storms or extinguish fires. Y'know, like any decent D&D cleric... The story might have come about because of misunderstandings of lithurgy, or because later era-priests were often dabbling in those new-fangled sciences... or the occult, who knows? Rumors go far. So the actual magic practices were often quite well-tied to religion, even if the interpretation of them goes against the orthodox interpretations of it. Not that it helps much, since the biggest group targeted by Christians in persecution were, predictably, other Christians (the wrong kind). As long as they had no Jews to persecute, that is. :p Erik |
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02-17-2010, 11:16 AM | #45 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: Witchcraft and Swashbuckling
Quote:
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02-17-2010, 12:35 PM | #46 |
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Re: Witchcraft and Swashbuckling
Considering how old M le Comte is purported to be, he could show up anywhere at any time.
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An ongoing narrative of philosophy, psychology, and semiotics: Et in Arcadia Ego "To an Irishman, a serious matter is a joke, and a joke is a serious matter." |
02-17-2010, 03:57 PM | #47 |
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: The Enchanted Land-O-Cheese
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Re: Witchcraft and Swashbuckling
There was a Spanish explorer named Alvar Núñez Cabeza de Vaca who was shipwrecked off the Gulf Coast in 1528 and spent eight years wandering through present day Texas and Mexico. During most of this time, he and his companions were captives of one Indian tribe or another. The natives kept them alive, because he and his companions had gained a reputation as magical healers. Basicly, they performed improvised rituals and prayers, but they had a good enough success rate that they impressed the natives and were allowed to live.
De Vaca's story is an interesting one. Not much swashbuckling in it, I'm afraid; but some grueling accounts of survival in the swashbuckling era. |
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kittens, pirate, swashbuckler, witch, witchcraft |
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