09-29-2017, 05:25 PM | #21 |
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
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Re: Waterfowl: Amphibious or Racial Swimming Skill?
Hm. Why is walk on liquid [15] while amphibious is [10]? Both will allow you to move across the surface of a body of water at full move, but amphibious also allows you to move underwater and eliminates penalties for operating underwater.
The big advantage of walk on liquid appears to be that your only point of contact is the bottom of your feet. This means you can protect yourself (and your possessions) from harmful effects of liquid by just wearing appropriate shoes, but amphibious really doesn't address how much of your body needs to be immersed. |
09-29-2017, 06:27 PM | #22 |
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Re: Waterfowl: Amphibious or Racial Swimming Skill?
Walk On keeping you high and dry has a bunch of knock-on effects. You can plant your feet for a stable position, you can jump or climb from a position fully out of the water, and your weapons are well out of the wet for use as well as wear-and-tear.
Amphibious doesn't change the basics of how you relate to the swimming medium. Something fairly far from human could justify parts that are reliably well clear of the water when at the surface, of course. EDIT: not saying the price is necessarily wise, though.
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09-29-2017, 07:55 PM | #23 |
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Yukon, OK
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Re: Waterfowl: Amphibious or Racial Swimming Skill?
The Extra 5 points could be considered more a UB premium but as noted there are some nice benefits.
Another one is your Ground Move is sued for water and land which is useful for Enhanced Move
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09-29-2017, 09:07 PM | #24 |
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: The plutonium rich regions of Washington State
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Re: Waterfowl: Amphibious or Racial Swimming Skill?
I was just out on both a kayak and a motorboat today. The water in the Columbia river was pretty choppy, not something I would call stable if you were standing on it, and of course the Yakima river was turbulent and roiling where it was deep and running over riffles where it was shallow and generally moving swiftly in either case except for slack water areas and backwater (and even there you can have eddies swirling around in places). Maybe if you spent 15 points for this advantage you wouldn't have to make DX checks for rough water to stay upright, but it is hard to see how this could be considered any kind of stable footing.
On something of a tangent, but a person in a kayak can paddle faster than a duck in the water. Or at least one person (me) in a kayak can paddle faster than most ducks in the water. Luke |
09-30-2017, 09:55 AM | #25 |
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
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Re: Waterfowl: Amphibious or Racial Swimming Skill?
You're also using big ol primate arms and a lever (paddle). That and it's a duck, which is a bit wee. It's a little unfair, like comparing a toy poodle running to someone on a bike...
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09-30-2017, 10:54 AM | #26 |
Join Date: Aug 2017
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Re: Waterfowl: Amphibious or Racial Swimming Skill?
First off, thanks to everyone for the input. I think I'm going to use the aspected Amphibious (Surface Only, -50%) [5] suggested on the first page, combined with a reduced Move score, but the discussion has been really interesting.
To be fair, during my research for statting up a swan form, I found that maximum swim speed for swans, while apparently not precisely measured, is estimated at about 5mph. And the circumstances described relative to that 5 mph speed definitely make it sound like a sprinting scenario. While still not comparable to primate arms with a lever, considering the size of swans, it suggests that most waterfowl aren't particularly fast for their size in water any more than on land. Again, diving ducks might be an exception due to legs being further back like other diving birds. OTOH, some of them rank very high for speed in level flight and most of them have pretty good endurance in the air. |
09-30-2017, 04:09 PM | #27 |
Join Date: Aug 2008
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Re: Waterfowl: Amphibious or Racial Swimming Skill?
I like Amphibious (Surface Only, -50%). Would you consider a cormorant as having full Amphibious?
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09-30-2017, 04:10 PM | #28 | |
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: The plutonium rich regions of Washington State
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Re: Waterfowl: Amphibious or Racial Swimming Skill?
Quote:
The same observation also applies to geese, coots, and swans. Although the coots do this literally running on water thing, partially flying but using their feet to push off from the surface as they go, leaving a series of ripples for tracks until they think they've gone far enough and then - ploop - back into the water. Luke |
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09-30-2017, 07:12 PM | #29 | |
Join Date: Aug 2017
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Re: Waterfowl: Amphibious or Racial Swimming Skill?
Quote:
@Humabout - Definitely full amphibious for a cormorant. Those birds are excellent divers, more agile underwater than on land. Having all four toes webbed instead of having a free rear toe like ducks is helpful in the water, but makes land-based locomotion even more awkward than the far-back legs alone would. |
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10-01-2017, 04:07 AM | #30 | |
Night Watchman
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Cambridge, UK
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Re: Waterfowl: Amphibious or Racial Swimming Skill?
Quote:
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