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09-21-2015, 01:30 AM | #1 |
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Eindhoven, the Netherlands
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[High-Tech] Question about the Baker Rifle vs the Brown Bess
So I'm reading this article on the Baker Rifle on War is Boring and, naturally, being a GURPS fan, I go to look up the stats. The article claims that the Brown Bess, the musket of the era, wasn't accurate past 70 yards, while the Baker Rifle was able to peg an officer at 600 yards.
According to GURPS High-Tech, the Brown Bess "was heavy and expensive, and had poor range and accuracy, (even compared with contemporary weapons)," while the Baker Rifle was a "successful flintlock rifle (issued) by elite rifle units in the British Army" So far, so good: the two sources agree. But when I look at the stats, the Brown Bess has an Acc of 2 and a range of 100/1100 while the Baker Rifle has an Acc of 3 and a Range of 80/900. I suspect the difference in range has more to do with the power behind the round not with the accuracy of the weapon, but an Acc of 2 is not particularly inaccurate (all the other TL 5 muskets have identical accuracy), and +1 acc is about a +50% accuracy increase. If the Brown Bess is only accurate to 70 yards, then the Baker Rifle would, according to these rules, only be accurate to 100. In reality, I suspect that Plunkett is just a fellow with exceptional accuracy and some serious Precision Aiming, but the difference seems to be that one couldn't be that accurate with a Brown Bess, while one could be that accurate with a Baker Rifle, but nothing in the statline really reflects this, nor the Brown Bess's notorious inaccuracy (noted by both article and book). In fact, from where I'm sitting, it looks like an adventurer would prefer the statline of the Brown Bess over the Baker Rifle: the former has a faster load time, superior damage, superior range and cheaper. The only real downsides are higher ST (not a problem for a hero), slightly heavier (1 lb) and worse recoil (irrelevant, of course). Thoughts? Is there a rule I'm missing covering smooth-bore inaccuracy? Is there errata? Is the difference "below the GURPS Threshold?"
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My Blog: Mailanka's Musing. Currently Playing: Psi-Wars, a step-by-step exploration of building your own Space Opera setting, inspired by Star Wars. |
09-21-2015, 04:10 AM | #2 |
Join Date: Oct 2008
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Re: [High-Tech] Question about the Baker Rifle vs the Brown Bess
I cannot say on the core question, as I have fired black powder guns only a few times and they have all been modern reproductions.
I agree that a +1 acc is a fairly small step. But with 4e the available steps are pretty low (0 being pocket pistol with no sights and 5 being a sniper rifle) so if one is barely 2 and other is a high 3.. rounding to few values can cause effects like that. Lets see the effects of firing at the target 600 yards away by RAW without cinematic things: Range penalty for 600 yards is -15 Step one: Base acc 3,and likely when you are sniping you do a careful load giving +1 acc=4. So lets see the weapon maximum: 22+acc*2. As that acc is said to include match ammo and the effect of careful loading is similar it should likely be added. so 22*8=30. So the maximum at 15 is good enough. So expected of a sniper: Deadeye so you can do precision aiming without a scope. Total modifiers: Accuracy +4, bracing +1, Extra aiming +2, precision aiming +4, Range -15 Total:-4 So fully doable if you have all the time in the world and reasonable skill. Note that skill over 19 only makes your shot quicker in this case. Now lets look at a more typical shooter with the musket and that 70 yard shot while fighting in the line: Range penalty for 70 yards: -9 Here we do not need to worry about the maximum acc. Accuracy: 2 and there is no careful loading thus stays 2 Total modifiers: Accuracy +2, Extra aiming +2, Range -9 Total:-5 So you would need a good skill to hit often at 70 yards. Also note that most people would get penalties for being under fire and such too. So first look: Both 600 yard sniper shots by experts and mostly misses at 70 yards look both reasonable numbers by RAW. Now the not so reasonable thing; Swapping the weapons in the examples would make: The sniping to be maximum effective skill 13 and the penalty -6. Still doable, but you start to need really high skill for reasonable hit probabilities. The firing normally would be total -4. Still requiring a good skill to hit reliably. So overall the distances given for normal effective shots and best sniper shots A note on adventurer use: A Fine(accurate) Brown Bess would still only be only $175 and have the same acc as the Baker rifle at just over half the cost... |
09-21-2015, 08:14 AM | #3 | |
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Re: [High-Tech] Question about the Baker Rifle vs the Brown Bess
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That won't really accomplish anything when "The bonus past the +Accuracy+2 for ordinary Aim maneuvers can’t exceed the lower of your scope’s bonus and your gun’s basic Accuracy."
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I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident. |
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09-21-2015, 08:56 AM | #4 | ||
Join Date: Oct 2008
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Re: [High-Tech] Question about the Baker Rifle vs the Brown Bess
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Thus a baic musket and a black power weapon would likely fall into that range (0-5) and not outside it With both likely being less accurate than a current sniper rifle but more than a pistol without sights giving likely available ranges of 1-4 actually. So if you actually read the thing in context instead of trying to detach it... If you are trying to claim that either of those should be above 5.. I would definitely argue against it.. Now if you instead tried arguing that a musket should be acc 1 and a black powder rifle should be acc 4 instead of 2 and 3 I would just shrug my shoulders and say "I have no idea". Quote:
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09-22-2015, 02:22 AM | #5 | ||
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Eindhoven, the Netherlands
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Re: [High-Tech] Question about the Baker Rifle vs the Brown Bess
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My Blog: Mailanka's Musing. Currently Playing: Psi-Wars, a step-by-step exploration of building your own Space Opera setting, inspired by Star Wars. |
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09-22-2015, 02:56 AM | #6 | ||
Join Date: Oct 2008
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Re: [High-Tech] Question about the Baker Rifle vs the Brown Bess
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Note that several organizations teach special long range shooting tricks to use without scopes. US marines being the most famous current example where from what I understand every marine is taught how to hit things out to 800 yards? with the basic rifle. Also the British army going into WW I was known for it's superb long range shooting. Both could be something else of course, but deadeye+Precision Aiming would at last work as solution to model such. Also the description for precision aiming separately caps it at acc +7 total (+2 base extra seconds, +5 precision aiming). There would really be no need for that note if you always had to use scopes as they as already capped at +5. |
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Tags |
black powder weapons, high tech, musketry |
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