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Old 09-22-2018, 11:26 AM   #51
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Default Re: Someone discovers Draka

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The biggest threat would be Germany's advantage in long range rockets. Without Operation Paperclip, U.S. solid rocket design would lag far behind. The loss of aerodynamic and materials research data would also retard liquid rocket designs. If atomic weapons are first used by someone other than Germany, Germany will quickly build them. German non-racial science was the best in the world in the 1930's, even with the anti-Semitic brain drain, German science was still very advanced. However these threats probably would not emerge before 1950ish.
Operation Paperclip didn't even start until 1945. Also as I mentioned before the German atom bomb program was three years behind the one of US. Hitler had thought the war would be over so soon that such "wonder weapons" as the V2 and atom bomb wouldn't come out soon enough to make any difference.

In fact, it wan't until 1942 that the German Army Ordnance even asked its scientists when it could expect nuclear weapons. The V2 and atom bomb for Germany were defensive weapons designed to make taking Germany so bloody that the inevitably victorious Allies would go for something less then unconditional surrender just to keep the body count down. (Nazis and the Bomb)

The plan was of course borne out of total desperation and its flaws are immediately obvious. It is not clear if one bomb the Germans did mange to build and test even worked. Even if it had it would have been produced a smaller yield then Little Boy. Then there would have been the issue of how to deliver it as Germany's air-force was in ruins by mid 1944.
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Old 09-22-2018, 06:04 PM   #52
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Default Re: Someone discovers Draka

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Operation Paperclip didn't even start until 1945. ...
My pardon if I was not clear, I was referring to large scale rocket research for the Paperclip information.
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Old 09-26-2018, 07:54 PM   #53
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My pardon if I was not clear, I was referring to large scale rocket research for the Paperclip information.
Which was dependent on the US getting Van Braun and what was left of the Nazi rocket group. It takes a lot of lucky successes by the Nazis for them not to be overrun by the Soviets by 1946, 1947 at the latest. The best they could hope for would be to conquer most of Europe and try to secure the vital oil fields of the Middle East.
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Old 09-26-2018, 09:40 PM   #54
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Default Re: Someone discovers Draka

The U.S. rocketry research wasn't as bad as many countries, Goddard had done a lot of research that Von Braun and others built on, but getting Von Braun definitely put the U.S. ahead of the game.

With the posited history of a Russia only front, Germany's job gets significantly easier, particularly if they take Moscow in 1941, lose Moscow, and Leningrad losses the minimal support it did get. No Leningrad siege frees up 500,000* men, or so to put on the front line. Another 750,000** are freed up with no need to defend against the U.K. and U.S.'s air campaign, as well as the roughly 35,000 to 40,000 88mm and 105mm AAA guns that could now be used for anti-tank work. furthermore, with no blockade Germany will be able to import oil, and various items that were in short supply in our history. While Germany will likely continue to build their Navy up, with no U-Boat war you will likely get a net increase in steel and machines capable of producing tank armor, as well as even more men.

A negotiated peace on the Eastern Front in WW II could look very similar to the end of WW I on the Eastern Front.

* There were nearly 750,000 men laying siege to Leningrad, I am assuming that roughly a third may have been good enough for a siege, but not open warfare on moving fronts.
** There were roughly 1,000,000 men manning AAA and fighting fires etc., I am assuming that roughly a third of those men would likely have still been needed for those services.
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