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Old 10-18-2017, 05:03 PM   #21
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Default Re: [Dungeons][DM only]My first experience in DFRPG/"I smell a Rat"

I've had a new player who'd only played CRPGs do really well with the "killing things and taking their stuff" aspect, but keep forgetting about things like hidden doors and concealed treasure.

I'm curious if a player familiar with Hidden Object games would more intuitively snoop around for things ;)
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Old 10-19-2017, 03:59 PM   #22
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Default Re: [Dungeons][DM only]My first experience in DFRPG/"I smell a Rat"

I haven't played yet, but just reading the adventure I feel like it relies too much on delvers' curiosity, or rather odious personal habit of thoroughly checking every wall they encounter. The characters aren't presented with any suggestion that Merle might have been hiding something -- quite the opposite, Lee is described as very stingy on information about her family, and unwilling to pay for anything other than getting rid of the noises in the cellar. So gather the rats, cover the hole in the cellar's wall and the quest is complete.
I can see my players maybe checking the pile of dirt in the cellar and finding the tunnel, but to look further, they'd have to rely on the meta-game knowledge of "there's something on the map".
Which is a shame, because from the flow of information and style of writing it's the best adventure I've ever read -- pretty much the only one that doesn't feel like a boring manual I have to read, but rather something I might want to read.
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Old 10-19-2017, 04:17 PM   #23
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Default Re: [Dungeons][DM only]My first experience in DFRPG/"I smell a Rat"

Ignoring half the adventure seems to be an acceptable ending here and while you are somewhat on your own for coming up with consequences for ignoring the cultists in a follow-up, it is a pretty solid hook for even a novice GM. At any rate if the PCs do ignore it, when I run it, that is how I will play it.
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Old 10-19-2017, 06:22 PM   #24
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Default Re: [Dungeons][DM only]My first experience in DFRPG/"I smell a Rat"

Based on an initial reading of this thread before my first session last week, I introduced a rumor of Merle's magical status (rumors of wizardry, but definitely not in the guild... curious). It was a minor bit, basically just rolling dice after the scene with Lee, and saying, "You remember hearing..." Worked great for the group, setting an even more ominous tone as they entered the basement.

Tomorrow afternoon we've got session two, so I'll see how the whole secret door thing plays out. (I found my old hex battlemat, so no more posters with all the secrets printed on them.)
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Old 10-19-2017, 11:33 PM   #25
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Default Re: [Dungeons][DM only]My first experience in DFRPG/"I smell a Rat"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kromm View Post
Very true! I guess I have high hopes that new players will read In the Dungeon (Exploits, pp. 18-25). :)
I read the section after I read your post. Now I think I should make a summary of In the Dungeon (Exploits, pp. 18-25) for any future players.

I will translate the headings and the relevant skills/advantages, so the players would know what kind of actions are expected for their delvers, and which PC will be suited for each task. I will also add important information such as "you need to announce to search for secret doors". If they get lost over what to do next, they can always go back to the summary and look what kind of tasks might be applicable in their situation.

In addition, I will add metal bars to the sewer so the PCs won't wander away too far. I will also place wooden boards in the tunnel that Merle used to avoid stepping into the sewer, to hint that Merle did not move so far in the sewer.

I plan to run the adventures at conventions in the future, so I do want to streamline the game so the players will interact with the different gimmicks beyond 3(a), and not waste time wandering the sewers looking for the (non-existent) source of rats.
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Old 11-03-2017, 02:47 PM   #26
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Default Re: [Dungeons][DM only]My first experience in DFRPG/"I smell a Rat"

All the encounters seem kinda not so bad, but the armor golem swordsman seems a bit impenetrable for a party that is composed mostly of mundane (that is, almost no magic) members. Are there any strategies I might suggest to a party that has a few warriors that just barely scratch 3d swing (which means chinks in armor wouldn't work well either)

I'm thinking that I might let them attack the eyes with no DR, but other than that, it seems like there are no tricks available to them to get through that much DR.... they can probably easily escape though, and I suggested acid for the box that they didn't have a thief to open, so they might attempt that. I don't think there are any mechanics for removing armor though even if the party dogpiled the golem and pried it apart piece by piece.
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Old 11-03-2017, 03:54 PM   #27
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Default Re: [Dungeons][DM only]My first experience in DFRPG/"I smell a Rat"

Few warriors, no thief, almost no casters . . . hmm, what did this party consist of? It sounds like they're the wrong people for the job, and in fact not well cut out for dungeons.

The way to kill a golem-armor swordsman is normally "major force." Looking at the sample delvers in Adventurers and Delvers To Go!: Argua would just bash it; Samar would call on Heroic Might, hope for a high roll, and then bash it; Llandor would shoot it in the eye (it has human vulnerabilities); Miao Miao and Sir Yvor would stab it in the eye (ditto); Masha would bide her time and charge up Breaking Blow with Power Blow; Ælin would try Lightning (treats metal as DR 1); Sister Miriam would max out Sunbolt at 9d and blast it, or put Might on a warrior so the warrior could bash it; Uncle Seamus would let rip with a 4d+4 or bigger Stone Missile; and Zephyra would get angry that it isn't living, so Deathtouch won't work, and just bury it with Entombment. The others would stay out of the way, though warriors who can't bash through the DR might grapple or slam the thing, while casters without good offensive spells might buff allies.

I hope those suggestions help!
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Old 11-04-2017, 09:10 AM   #28
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Default Re: [Dungeons][DM only]My first experience in DFRPG/"I smell a Rat"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kromm View Post
Few warriors, no thief, almost no casters . . . hmm, what did this party consist of? It sounds like they're the wrong people for the job, and in fact not well cut out for dungeons.

The way to kill a golem-armor swordsman is normally "major force." Looking at the sample delvers in Adventurers and Delvers To Go!: Argua would just bash it; Samar would call on Heroic Might, hope for a high roll, and then bash it; Llandor would shoot it in the eye (it has human vulnerabilities); Miao Miao and Sir Yvor would stab it in the eye (ditto); Masha would bide her time and charge up Breaking Blow with Power Blow; Ælin would try Lightning (treats metal as DR 1); Sister Miriam would max out Sunbolt at 9d and blast it, or put Might on a warrior so the warrior could bash it; Uncle Seamus would let rip with a 4d+4 or bigger Stone Missile; and Zephyra would get angry that it isn't living, so Deathtouch won't work, and just bury it with Entombment. The others would stay out of the way, though warriors who can't bash through the DR might grapple or slam the thing, while casters without good offensive spells might buff allies.

I hope those suggestions help!
Ah, if the eyes have no DR, then that might work.
The party is a knight (3dish), holy warrior(2dish), swashbuckler(3dish), a thief (1dish), and a Cleric (some buffs, but no sunbolt)

But the knight and the swashbuckler easily have the skill to hit the eye with a thrust if the eyes don't have the huge huge DR. 17, on average is neutralizing almost 5d damage, but lucky damage rolls from the knight or swashbuckler might do chip damage.
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Old 11-04-2017, 11:15 AM   #29
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Default Re: [Dungeons][DM only]My first experience in DFRPG/"I smell a Rat"

A not-so-secret side to high monster DR in the DFRPG is that it fills a role similar to high HP in other FPRGs: It means the heroes must spend more time killing the monster (as they try repeated low-odds attacks to the eyes, low-damage hits that might luckily roll high, etc.), allowing the monster to take more shots at the delvers. Good active defenses serve the same purpose. A creature could have lots of HP in another game because it's huge (actual HP in the DFRPG), a tank (high DR in the DFRPG), or very capable (high active defenses in the DFRPG). This game distinguishes a bit more.
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Old 11-04-2017, 11:29 AM   #30
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Default Re: [Dungeons][DM only]My first experience in DFRPG/"I smell a Rat"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kromm View Post
A not-so-secret side to high monster DR in the DFRPG is that it fills a role similar to high HP in other FPRGs: It means the heroes must spend more time killing the monster (as they try repeated low-odds attacks to the eyes, low-damage hits that might luckily roll high, etc.), allowing the monster to take more shots at the delvers. Good active defenses serve the same purpose.
Except it doesn't end up working that way if there is a Scout in the party. Eye shots are literally their bread-and-butter.

Likewise a Knight that decides to suck up a blow or two and do an All-Out-Attack (Determined) and just go for the eyes. One good stab from Bash Crashky and this beast is done (or maybe two from Sir Ivor, maybe).
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