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Old 06-23-2020, 11:44 AM   #31
swordtart
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Default Re: The shurkin challenge.

Anything behind only 3 points of armour is going to be ablated by half the hits by from a 1D weapon.

I don't doubt that your eggshell armed with hammers could make a kill in the arena. That assumes it can last the 3 or 4 seconds needed to get into point blank range and that you can hit with enough HRs to penetrate your opponent. I think that survival is marginal at best.

I doubt whether you will survive beyond those 3 or 4 seconds to collect your winnings and that is its fundamental fatal flaw.
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Old 06-23-2020, 01:35 PM   #32
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Default Re: The shurkin challenge.

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Originally Posted by swordtart View Post
I don't doubt that your eggshell armed with hammers could make a kill in the arena. That assumes it can last the 3 or 4 seconds needed to get into point blank range and that you can hit with enough HRs to penetrate your opponent. I think that survival is marginal at best.
Indeed -- I'd prefer one of my INS subs with the 5-6 points of Metal.

I look at the _Shuriken HR_ as a road-raider ambush design; pops out of cover, "volleys the pila", and hopes like heck the opponent doesn't survive. I think there's a design like that in one of the old TSR _CW_ adventure books (usually, it doesn't work :) ).
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Old 06-23-2020, 03:06 PM   #33
swordtart
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Default Re: The shurkin challenge.

In that case, I'd bin the side mounted HRs (maybe put on some external rocket pods facing front instead) and put all the armour on the front (layered with plastic). Give the driver an ejector seat and he can volley the pila and then eject.

The empty vehicle will still work as it ploughs on, possibly colliding with the target, but at the least causing it to take evasive action.

To be honest that is the Ninja Shirukens real purpose, to be lobbed at an enemy to distract them.

That might a useful niche vehicle.
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Old 06-23-2020, 04:21 PM   #34
swordtart
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Default Re: The shurkin challenge.

Sui-Shiruken by Swordtart:
Luxury; Light chassis; Light suspension;
Large PP with HTMs with 10 pt CA;
4 Hvy Duty Radial tires.
Driver with 10pt CA.
1 Space Rocket Magazine with 3 x AP Mini Rocket and 5 pt CA (Front),
15 x AP Mini Rocket (Front),
2spc Forward Facing REWP with 6 x AP Mini Rocket (Right),
2spc Forward Facing REWP with 6 x AP Mini Rocket (Left),
Link (All Rockets + Ejection Seat + Boosters);
Ejection Seat;
Bumper Trigger linked to (All Rockets + Ejection Seat + Boosters),
Rocket boosters (30lb) +5 accel.
9 pts. Sloped LR Metal and 30 pts. Sloped Plastic
(F: 9/9 R: 0/7 L: 0/7 B: 0/5 T: 0/1 U: 0/1);
Cargo 3 lb
Cost: $9,745, Wgt: 4,947,
HC: 2, Top Speed: 92.5 (67.5), Accel: 5 (10)

A close attack platform the Sui-Shiruken needs to get within 20 yards undetected. When close enough it fires 2 single ranging shots from its rocket magazine. The final shot from the magazine is linked to all the other rockets for a devastating 29 rocket barrage. The driver usually ejects shortly after the simultaneous ignition of the rocket boosters allowing the empty vehicle to act as an un-guided missile.

As a last resort the rockets and boosters are also tied into front bumper switches in case the driver is killed or ejects early.

Whilst being attacked by one of these is likely to be an unpleasant experience, you can take comfort that at least another Shiruken is being removed from the gene pool.


Whilst probably lethal, all those rockets are certainly a distraction. Lots of sloped metal backed up with plastic on the front provide high front aspect survivability against even 3D+ weapons. Any damage penetrating the front is likely to only remove a single rocket. The magazine rockets have extra protection as loosing the sustained fire bonus would be sub-optimal. The plant is next in line and also has CA. If the plant is destroyed the rockets can still be fired (fire is a risk that must be tolerated). With rocket boosters (triggered independently) the vehicle may still be able to maintain speed. Even if damage gets through all that the driver has yet more CA so should still survive to trigger the rockets on command.

The all other arcs are vulnerable which is why this vehicle needs to engage on a vector of it's choosing (usually sweeping in from a side road). The timing is fairly critical and so the vehicle will try to match speeds if possible and turn in so that it can target the rear arc to minimise targeting penalties due to relative speed.

Assuming all the ranging rockets get off, on average half the rockets will hit averaging 50 points damage, this would prove decisive against the majority of conventional road vehicles (even some rigs don't mount that much). If the ram happens then you could double that.

If the intent is to hunt foes with light metal armour you might prefer to use non-AP rockets and save some cash. You would almost certainly be better off waiting for an easier target. You could replace the mini-rockets with other single shot rockets, but you would need to adjust the weight and revise the REWP. The rocket magazine makes less sense with larger rockets as it becomes an increasing proportion of your payload spent on ranging shots. For example for an HR version you could loose the magazine and instead have 6 HR front and another in a top REWP. This leaves 90lb for cargo (or more armour).

As this is a sacrificial vehicle you could fit a damaged plant (with only 5 DPs) and save $1800. You could also use jury-rigged rockets (at whatever they would cost).

Last edited by swordtart; 06-24-2020 at 04:46 AM.
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Old 06-24-2020, 02:17 PM   #35
juris
 
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Default Re: The shurkin challenge.

Sorry but Dynamax has you beat (not my design, from AM's stock car list):

Mad Bomber -- Van, Standard chassis, Heavy suspension, Large power plant, Fire Extinguisher, 4 Heavy-Duty tires, Driver w/SWC and 10-pt CA, 9 Heavy Rockets Front, Junk Droppers Left and Right and Back each w/10-pt CA, Link (5 HRs), Link (4 HRs), Link (all JDs), Composite Metal/Plastic Armor: F10/10, L0/9, R0/9, B0/9, T0/1, U0/1, 2 Fake Wheelguards Back, 4 Fake Wheelhubs, Gear Allocation: [13 lbs.], Acceleration 5, Top Speed 90, HC 2, 5987 lbs., $9982

Same cost as your Sui-Shirukin. Just add blow through concealment to the HRs and use the junk droppers to escape (unlikely but safer than an ejection seat which makes you a clay pigeon). Exploits the van's 10 spaces of possible front weapons. Vans no longer suck (as much) with CA.
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Old 06-24-2020, 02:44 PM   #36
swordtart
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Default Re: The shurkin challenge.

Not really based on the Shiruken though ;) We can all design better vehicles if we aren't tied to the turkey ;)

Can you have 10 spaces in the front, surely the cargo spaces don't count towards the 1/3 spaces per arc maximum? We always played that it had 8 maximum (but I am happy to be corrected).

Last edited by swordtart; 06-24-2020 at 02:52 PM.
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Old 06-24-2020, 03:38 PM   #37
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Default Re: The shurkin challenge.

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Can you have 10 spaces in the front, surely the cargo spaces don't count towards the 1/3 spaces per arc maximum? We always played that it had 8 maximum (but I am happy to be corrected).
That's one of Those Questions -- "it depends on who was interpreting the rules at the time".
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Old 06-25-2020, 02:50 PM   #38
swordtart
 
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Default Re: The shurkin challenge.

Oh cool. It was me, so I must have been right ;)

Being based in the UK, I never had the opportunity to attend any CW tournaments. It's things like this that make me heartily glad of it.
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Old 06-25-2020, 05:51 PM   #39
juris
 
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Default Re: The shurkin challenge.

No 5 front RLs vans in your games? ;) I call it the 'RocketVan' because I'm creative.

As for tournaments I never attended either but I did play CW at a recent con where everyone used slightly different rules. I just shrugged it off as someone opened fire on me with illegally linked MGs - turreted VMG. Whatever it was fun. Obviously their pit crew was better than mine. That's the state of the game 20 years after the last supplement was published.

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Oh cool. It was me, so I must have been right ;)

Being based in the UK, I never had the opportunity to attend any CW tournaments. It's things like this that make me heartily glad of it.
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Old 06-26-2020, 01:59 AM   #40
swordtart
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Default Re: The shurkin challenge.

Agreed Juris.

One of the WH40K judges used to be really hard over about people playing by the rules (and with that game configuration management was a nightmare). Many games just dissolved into rules arguments which sucked all the fun out of it.

He had a conversation with Jervis Johnson about it and he was told that Jervis always used the rule "Jervis says YES". Basically if Jervis was playing, once a rule came into question he just asked his opponent how they thought it worked and would then just agree with that interpretation. Then they could move on with the game.

If Jervis won under those terms he had REALLY won. But generally he wasn't playing to win, he was playing to have fun. The new judge started to follow that philosophy and realised that he'd been missing the point.

So if in doubt... "Jervis says YES"
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