Fantasy = Cinematic ?

[Grey Goblin]

A stupid question, perhaps... Are standard fantasy settings cinematic by default? I've been working on a 'realistic' character for a fantasy game, the best he can be without cinematic advantages, only to realize that in any setting where magic and mages exist, pretty much anything goes, so why not cinematic advantages too. Your thoughts?

[tshiggins]

Originally Posted by Grey Goblin

A stupid question, perhaps... Are standard fantasy settings cinematic by default? I've been working on a 'realistic' character for a fantasy game, the best he can be without cinematic advantages, only to realize that in any setting where magic and mages exist, pretty much anything goes, so why not cinematic advantages too. Your thoughts?

It depends on what type of magic the campaign uses. If it's the standard GURPS college-based skill magic, then it gets pretty cinematic, in a hurry.

However, if you use some flavor of ritual magic, where effects take a long time to create (no ritual adepts) and can be stored in only limited quantities, then things get dampened down, in a hurry.

If a mage can have only about a half-dozen spells prepped, and perhaps a few items charged and couple of potion brewed, the tone of the campaign changes significantly. Yeah, he or she is going to be hell on wheels once or twice, but must carefully husband magical resources until use of them is really necessary.

In those campaigns, magic is still an incredibly powerful and useful asset, but it gets used only rarely, in times of dire need or to accomplish something specific after careful planning. That's not terribly cinematic -- but can be quite dramatic.

[OldSam]

I'd say the first step is to ask yourself what should be "normal"... With magic of course (more or less) anything goes, but the deciding difference is if that anything happens in 1 of 10 or 1 of 100.000 cases - the latter being more realistic/lower fantasy.

Also it's primarily a question of "feeling", whether you want it hard/gritty/deadly or more heroic/over-the-top etc.

There are many fantasy settings where magic is quite rare and most people (NPCs) are living ordinary lives, lacking combat training, that is why cinematic moves typically are not the default.

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Grey Goblin

A stupid question, perhaps... Are standard fantasy settings cinematic by default? I've been working on a 'realistic' character for a fantasy game, the best he can be without cinematic advantages, only to realize that in any setting where magic and mages exist, pretty much anything goes, so why not cinematic advantages too. Your thoughts?

Not just no but extremely vehemently no. You might look up 'argumentum ad fireballum'.

There's nothing wrong with cinematic fantasy of course, and a lot of source material is very much in line with that. But it's absolutely not the case that the presence of magic precludes a realistic approach elsewhere (and even incorporated into the magic, around the necessary breaks from reality).

[Anthony]

It depends on what you mean by 'cinematic' and what you mean by 'fantasy'. For many fantasy settings, you will be able to buy certain advantages that GURPS labels as 'cinematic' or 'fantasy', but exactly which you can buy, and under what circumstances, is a setting design issue. As for being cinematic, that's an issue of game style, not really what you can buy.

[whswhs]

When you ask "Are standard fantasy settings cinematic by default?" what are you thinking of as a standard fantasy campaign?

In my fantasy campaigns, I've used

Griffin Mountain from Chaosium: A primitive wilderness area filled with nonhuman races, spirits, monsters, and cults
A later Roman Empire where the gods have withdrawn their favor
A faerie realm adjacent to the present-day British Isles
Present-day Hong Kong with World of Darkness mages
E. R. Eddison's fantasy world of Zimiamvia, where the heroes and heroines are avatars of the gods
An alternate Middle-Earth where Sauron won and the heroes are the resistance fighters
An isolated castle occupied by five magically gifted clans set in a patch of order surrounded by wild magic
A midwestern university invaded by demon participants in a reality TV show about tempting mortals into sin
The Pearl Bright Ocean from GURPS Cabal
A medieval English university with a large Faculty of Magic
An invented fantasy world with seven intelligent humanoid races, multiple cultures for each race, and a system of magic based on rapport with the local spirits

That's nearly a dozen campaign with very different settings. Do any of them seem like "standard fantasy worlds" to you?

It seems to me that numbers 4, 5, 6, and 9 were strongly cinematic, and in some cases, that was the point (I mean, one of the Pearl Bright Ocean PCs was the deified Errol Flynn!). Numbers 1, 7, 10, and 11 were fairly far from cinematic—even though cinematic skills were definitely available in number 11!

[Flyndaran]

Elves with acne and dysentery. I would call that fantasy but almost certainly not cinematic.

[(E)]

I think it is quite easy to put some cinematic switches into fantasy. Do elves walk on top of deep snow for example? This may be a fantasy staple in your opinion, mechanically it is no different from a monk walking on rice paper and leaving no mark which is a standard cinematic martial arts ability.

Heroic fantasy is closer to cinematic.

[jason taylor]

Originally Posted by OldSam

I'd say the first step is to ask yourself what should be "normal"... With magic of course (more or less) anything goes, but the deciding difference is if that anything happens in 1 of 10 or 1 of 100.000 cases - the latter being more realistic/lower fantasy.

Also it's primarily a question of "feeling", whether you want it hard/gritty/deadly or more heroic/over-the-top etc.

There are many fantasy settings where magic is quite rare and most people (NPCs) are living ordinary lives, lacking combat training, that is why cinematic moves typically are not the default.

I don't think quite "anything" goes with magic. Most magic systems have rules. In Tolkien for instance magic has an almost Manichian effect(good amulets automatically intimidate evil characters and vice-versa).

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by (E)

Heroic fantasy is closer to cinematic.

I think it would be more accurate historically (though not in GURPS terms) to say that both are variants on epic—a style of storytelling that favors a broad sweep of action, with larger than life heroes and not too many inconvenient practical details getting in the way of the story. Homer and Vyasa were telling stories in that style long before photography was thought of.