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Old 03-19-2019, 04:15 PM   #1
Black Echo
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Default Calculating starting MI squads in a custom scenario

If you're designing a custom scenario and you assign one side a certain number of armor units, how do you determine how many infantry strength points that side also gets?

Maybe I missed it ... but I've been around OGRE since 1980 so I think I've read just about everything out there and still I can't remember a formula for determining starting infantry strength points as a percentage of starting armor units (if there is such a formula). I've seen the armor unit equivalents for OGRES but if you try to recreate the original OGRE scenario with a different or bigger OGRE, while there's a table to give the amount of armor units that should be a (more or less even) match against the OGRE ... there's no calculation that shows how much infantry strength points to put with that armor when facing a different OGRE.

I've wondered this for a long time (decades) and just kind of played it fast and loose using the best guess. Can anyone help me out?
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Old 03-19-2019, 04:49 PM   #2
HeatDeath
 
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Default Re: Calculating starting MI squads in a custom scenario

On a strictly statistical basis, a 3-strength infantry platoon is worth 1 armor unit.

But realistically, their rules and tactics are so different that there's no universal answer. It really depends on how mobile you want the battle to be.

Armor-only battles are grand swooping affairs. Battles with lots of dug-in infantry tend more towards static lines and the concentrated breaking thereof.
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Old 03-19-2019, 04:55 PM   #3
Desert Scribe
 
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Default Re: Calculating starting MI squads in a custom scenario

For orange-map games using just the Ogre rules, I would just extrapolate from existing scenarios to determine a ratio of infantry strength points to armor units:

Code:
Mark III attacking: 20 SP + 12 AU = 1.67 ratio infantry to armor
Mark V attacking: 30 SP + 20 AU = 1.5 ratio
two Mark IIIs attacking: 36 SP + 28 AU (per errata) = 1.29 ratio
                         30 SP + 22 AU (per ODE scenario book) = 1.36 ratio
So for every 10 armor units, from 13 to 16 infantry strength points.
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Last edited by Desert Scribe; 03-19-2019 at 04:56 PM. Reason: Fixed a typo.
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Old 03-20-2019, 01:15 AM   #4
Izzy_B
 
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Default Re: Calculating starting MI squads in a custom scenario

Some calculate in terms of “victory points” some use the 3 to 1 rule as above. The trouble with assigning av overall pool of victory points to be split between armor and infantry is the values for different types of ogres can make things seem imbalanced.
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Old 03-20-2019, 08:13 AM   #5
offsides
 
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Default Re: Calculating starting MI squads in a custom scenario

I've always thought that it depends on the purpose of the scenario. When it's totally balanced objectively like ceasefire collapse then I think each side should be able to choose their force balance based entirely on VP - whoever picks the better balance for handling their opponent will probably win, and this mirrors real life. Other scenarios are based on having a particular set of forces that are matched up to balance out the objectives and/or terrain, and deviating too far from that may unbalance things one way or another (e.g., the "charging uphill shouldn't win a civil war battle" situation). In that case, I think it's trial and error, along with a little bit of luck. That said, it seems like having INF make up 30-40% of the total force is probably a good starting point if you don't have something more specific in mind (like a HWZ w/ INF screen, etc).
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Old 03-21-2019, 07:07 AM   #6
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Default Re: Calculating starting MI squads in a custom scenario

The scenario that I've played the most, and my personal favorite, is Ceasefire Collapse. In this one, we've always allowed players to trade armor for infantry at the rate of 1 AU = 3 INF, and it has seemed to work well.

In other scenarios, we've traditionally stuck with the force mix that's listed for them. We've allowed for trading at the 3 to 1 rate, but players mostly don't swap anything, So, I don't have a feel how swapping at that rate affects the play balance for them.

For custom scenarios, I've always just started with what "feels right" and adjusted up or down as we've play tested them. Generally, I start with a 1 AU to 1.5 INF ratio, adjust based on the nature of the scenario.
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