Battlesuits for smaller users...

[Pragmatic]

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

That's sort of how it works ...it adds to the users native ST.

Ghostdancer

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

Those enhancements represent muscular augmentation, not replacement. You can still use your personal muscles to help move your armored body.

Again, the same suit, worn by two different users of different ST, end up having different maximum ST.

You'd think that the myomer (?) muscles would be the limiting factor, not whether or not the user is a bodybuilder.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Again, the same suit, worn by two different users of different ST, end up having different maximum ST.

You'd think that the myomer (?) muscles would be the limiting factor, not whether or not the user is a bodybuilder.

That's a darn good point but the problem (to me) seems to be that fitting in all the same augments in less space for less cost is well...it just doesn't pass the acid test for me. I am not being intentionally obstinate but I just cannot wrap my head around the SM -4 creature getting the same exact bonus with a suit built for him that a SM 0 creature would.

Ghostdancer

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Again, the same suit, worn by two different users of different ST, end up having different maximum ST.

You'd think that the myomer (?) muscles would be the limiting factor, not whether or not the user is a bodybuilder.

...Why would you think that? When two things cooperate, the result is not that one of them dictates and the other has no significance whatsoever.

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

That's a darn good point but the problem (to me) seems to be that fitting in all the same augments in less space for less cost is well...it just doesn't pass the acid test for me. I am not being intentionally obstinate but I just cannot wrap my head around the SM -4 creature getting the same exact bonus with a suit built for him that a SM 0 creature would.

Ghostdancer

What multiple people are persistently trying to tell you is that Ultratech has no rules for power armor on an SM-4 creature.

This may or may not be true, but you don't seem to have noticed that that's what is being asserted...

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

What multiple people are persistently trying to tell you is that Ultratech has no rules for power armor on an SM-4 creature.

This may or may not be true, but you don't seem to have noticed that that's what is being asserted...

Wow. Thats not how I've read the adjusting for SM section, but seeing as multiple people have said it, I guess I could be wrong.

Thanks everyone, I guess my question is answered (sort of) :/

Ghostdancer

[Pragmatic]

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

...Why would you think that? When two things cooperate, the result is not that one of them dictates and the other has no significance whatsoever.

Forgive me, but I have absolutely no idea what that means in this conversation.

Take a Ferrari. Put it on a mile-long track. Have me and race-car driver Jeff Gordon both absolutely floor it. We're both going to get the same maximum speed out of the car, because that's how the car was built. It doesn't matter if his hand-eye coordination is better, or if his skill is better, or whatever. Putting a cement block on the accelerator will do the same thing.

But that's what we have with the battlesuits. They're not treated as vehicles or equipment, they're treated as power-ups.

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Take a Ferrari. Put it on a mile-long track. Have me and race-car driver Jeff Gordon both absolutely floor it. We're both going to get the same maximum speed out of the car, because that's how the car was built. It doesn't matter if his hand-eye coordination is better, or if his skill is better, or whatever. Putting a cement block on the accelerator will do the same thing.

Yes, but he will probably react faster to the start and he'll certainly manage the gear-shift better to reach his maximum speed faster.

There's a good chance that by the time you reach the end, you will not yet have hit the maximum speed. He, on the other hand, will maximise the potential for the car and get there faster than you, achieving a higher max speed in teh process.

[Pragmatic]

Originally Posted by Icelander

Yes, but he will probably react faster to the start and he'll certainly manage the gear-shift better to reach his maximum speed faster.

There's a good chance that by the time you reach the end, you will not yet have hit the maximum speed. He, on the other hand, will maximise the potential for the car and get there faster than you, achieving a higher max speed in teh process.

Not talking about fine-control. I'm talking about brute strength. (Speed, in the case of the car.)

Arthur from The Tick and Arnold (the former governator of California...) both try out a battlesuit. Why can Arthur (a pudgy accountant by day) only get the suit to lift as if it had ST 20, but Arnold (an aging ex-bodybuilder) can get the suit to lift as if it had ST 25? Did the suit suddenly gain a lot more horsepower when worn by former bodybuilders?

Likewise, does the Ferrari lose horsepower when I drive it? I'm pretty sure that, if I put my foot down and keep it down, it's eventually going to hit its top speed. It may take me twice as long as someone who's got better (for instance) DX than me, but... well, it's the engineers who designed the car that set its limits, not the person who's flooring the gas pedal.

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Forgive me, but I have absolutely no idea what that means in this conversation.

Take a Ferrari. Put it on a mile-long track. Have me and race-car driver Jeff Gordon both absolutely floor it. We're both going to get the same maximum speed out of the car, because that's how the car was built. It doesn't matter if his hand-eye coordination is better, or if his skill is better, or whatever. Putting a cement block on the accelerator will do the same thing.

But that's what we have with the battlesuits. They're not treated as vehicles or equipment, they're treated as power-ups.

Battlesuits are not vehicles. They aren't like vehicles either. A vehicle, as you say, doesn't care who is in it...it has basically the same performance whether the driver is a newbie, a master, or a cinderblock. Because the driver doesn't really make any contribution to the vehicle's propulsion.

In a battlesuit, the movement of the limbs is performed by the wearer's muscles. The suit assists, but it doesn't replace.

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Likewise, does the Ferrari lose horsepower when I drive it? I'm pretty sure that, if I put my foot down and keep it down, it's eventually going to hit its top speed. It may take me twice as long as someone who's got better (for instance) DX than me, but... well, it's the engineers who designed the car that set its limits, not the person who's flooring the gas pedal.

You know that a car has more than one gear, right? So putting the foot down and keeping it down succeeds only at revvying the engine high enough to burn it out eventually and nets you less than half the maximum speed of the vehicle.

[Pragmatic]

So, if I'm driving a forklift, I can get it to lift 2000lbs.

But 'Roid Rage Randy over there, he can get it to lift 3000lbs. (Not a real person, just an extreme example.)

Gotcha. Because, using our muscles somehow is the limiting factor of what ST the forklift has in its hydraulics.

Going back to the racecar example, it doesn't matter if it's me driving or Jeff Gordon. There's no way that even the best driver in the world can get a Ferrari to break the sound barrier, because it's not designed to be able to do it.

The machinery of the battlesuit has an upper limit of what it can get out of it. It doesn't matter if it's me driving the battlesuit, or if it's "Randy." The hydraulics/myomer/whatever that supplies the ST will top out.

In which case, it should be a simple matter of recalibrating the settings on the amplification, rather than adding an "11" to the scale. (Spinal Tap reference...)