Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-15-2016, 06:54 AM   #1
vicky_molokh
GURPS FAQ Keeper
 
vicky_molokh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
Default [Social Engineering] "I could bring down your Government with six words."

Greetings, all!

I'm curious: what are the ways to replicate this feat in GURPS, especially as a grand feat of social engineering?
Spoiler:  


A short sentence said at the right moment to the right person ultimately results in a PM receiving a vote of no confidence after a while.

Now, I know it's tempting to just say that it's an Affliction with a Negated Advantage, but that doesn't seem to accurately reflect what is happening here. It seems like instead of a very narrow brute force ability, the scene was an illustration of a character deeply specialized in social tricks ("Talking. It's what I do!").

So what is it? Some sort of Propaganda success by a ridiculous margin? If yes, any way of estimating how much of a margin is required to replicate this or similar feats? Or perhaps this is something different?

Thanks in advance!
__________________
Vicky 'Molokh', GURPS FAQ and uFAQ Keeper
vicky_molokh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2016, 07:10 AM   #2
Stormcrow
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ronkonkoma, NY
Default Re: [Social Engineering] "I could bring down your Government with six words."

Politics-30.
Stormcrow is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2016, 07:39 AM   #3
kdtipa
 
kdtipa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Southern New Hampshire
Default Re: [Social Engineering] "I could bring down your Government with six words."

Very cool thought exercise. My impulse reaction though is that this is not a case of a character ability specifically, but a case of the player being wonderfully clever. The player knows something useful, and puts it to use extremely well.

I might ask for a roll from any of...
  • Acting
  • Carousing
  • Current Affairs: Politics
  • Diplomacy
  • Enthrallment
  • Fast-Talk
  • Fortune-Telling (it's about reading people and saying something they might believe right?)
  • Performance
  • Philosophy
  • Politics
  • Psychology
  • Public Speaking (since it's a general skill of speaking well, I think this would need to succeed by a lot)
  • Savoir-Faire (perhaps some custom or another would be enough to make a politician bow-out)
  • Sex Appeal
  • Sociology
  • Strategy (if the situation has military components, this might lead you to something that would depose a politician)
  • Streetwise

Of course, the skill called for would depend on how the player is trying to play it. And if they can pull off 6 word sentence that makes me as the GM think that the character they're trying to influence would be so significantly affected, then I'd try to find the right skill and ask for a roll (and give them a hefty bonus for the great role-playing).
kdtipa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2016, 07:57 AM   #4
Icelander
 
Icelander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
Default Re: [Social Engineering] "I could bring down your Government with six words."

Isn't this just threathening to use a pretty hefty Favor*, which can be called in with six words, to add a bonus to an Influence roll?

If the character has a lot of these, consider giving him a Modular Ability that can be used for Allies, Contacts, Favors, Patrons and suchlike, maybe with some Limitations to represent that if he chooses to call upon Unwilling aid and/or do something very dramatic (like bringing down a government), he cannot use it among that group of people again for a while.

*Presumably from a majority of MP, whether by party lines or a voting block formed around some issue.
__________________
Za uspiekh nashevo beznadiozhnovo diela!
Icelander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2016, 08:13 AM   #5
vicky_molokh
GURPS FAQ Keeper
 
vicky_molokh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
Default Re: [Social Engineering] "I could bring down your Government with six words."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Icelander View Post
Isn't this just threathening to use a pretty hefty Favor*, which can be called in with six words, to add a bonus to an Influence roll?
No. The six words in question are "Don't you think she looks tired?" addressed to the PM's surviving underling, as quoted in the OP.
__________________
Vicky 'Molokh', GURPS FAQ and uFAQ Keeper
vicky_molokh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2016, 08:21 AM   #6
Kalzazz
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Default Re: [Social Engineering] "I could bring down your Government with six words."

Whatever I'd make them roll normally, then at -10 for instant use. Same as single round first aid being -10

As for specific rolls . . . . Quick Contest of Politics? I'd probably give the incumbent +8 or so to avoid dethroning? I think incumbents usually have advantage

If you can beat Politics +8 with your Politics -10, then you are a groovy political dude
Kalzazz is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2016, 08:21 AM   #7
Mailanka
 
Mailanka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Eindhoven, the Netherlands
Default Re: [Social Engineering] "I could bring down your Government with six words."

I think this specific example is a use of the History skill by a time traveler.

There are lots of points in history where a small, precise change would seem to make a huge difference. For example, it should be pretty easy to save the Archduke Ferdinand and thus, presumably, stop WW1. And if you've seen multiple possible timelines, then you have a pretty clear view of what could be your root cause of an event. So, he might know what brought down the Harriet Jones government and what didn't, what particularly moment was especially critical, and he could precipitate it at that moment.

In a sense, this is like classic social engineering, in that he's finding the one point in a system where he can break it and applying the exact words necessary to do it, but like real social engineering (the hacking kind) it requires extensive technical knowledge that lies outside of the purview of social skills to turn a seemingly innocuous statement into something powerful.
__________________
My Blog: Mailanka's Musing. Currently Playing: Psi-Wars, a step-by-step exploration of building your own Space Opera setting, inspired by Star Wars.
Mailanka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2016, 04:30 PM   #8
David Johnston2
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Default Re: [Social Engineering] "I could bring down your Government with six words."

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
Greetings, all!

I'm curious: what are the ways to replicate this feat in GURPS, especially as a grand feat of social engineering?
Spoiler:  


A short sentence said at the right moment to the right person ultimately results in a PM receiving a vote of no confidence after a while.

Now, I know it's tempting to just say that it's an Affliction with a Negated Advantage, but that doesn't seem to accurately reflect what is happening here. It seems like instead of a very narrow brute force ability, the scene was an illustration of a character deeply specialized in social tricks ("Talking. It's what I do!").

So what is it? Some sort of Propaganda success by a ridiculous margin? If yes, any way of estimating how much of a margin is required to replicate this or similar feats? Or perhaps this is something different?

Thanks in advance!
History skill in combination with "Unusual Origin: Time Traveler" can be really powerful thing.
David Johnston2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2016, 05:58 PM   #9
Gedrin
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Default Re: [Social Engineering] "I could bring down your Government with six words."

Tardis and a copy of the movie Groundhog Day.
Gedrin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2016, 06:10 PM   #10
jason taylor
 
jason taylor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Portland, Oregon
Default Re: [Social Engineering] "I could bring down your Government with six words."

"You have sat here too long for any good you are doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!"

Leo Amery to Parliament(copying Oliver Cromwell), before resignation of Nevelle Chamberlain.

Twenty-eight words if I count right. A little uneconomical.
__________________
"The navy could probably win a war without coffee but would prefer not to try"-Samuel Eliot Morrison
jason taylor is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
doctor who, government, propaganda, rank, six words, social engineering, the doctor

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:17 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.