Melee Skill/Weapon questions

[Der Wanderer]

@Main-Gauche Skill
Is there anything that the Knife skill can do that the Main-Gauche skill can't?

@Kakute (MA227)
If the hero wears Kakute on both hands and grapples two handed does the bonus vs. break free stack? Or is the default assumption that Kakute are worn on both hands?

@Rokushaku Kama (MA 222)
Does this still use the staff skill?
If yes, should a -1 penalty to hit apply as for the Qian Kun Ri Yue Dao?

[Maz]

Originally Posted by Der Wanderer

@Main-Gauche Skill
Is there anything that the Knife skill can do that the Main-Gauche skill can't?

Well first off it's DX/E not DX/A (as M-G is). So that's +1 to effective skill right there.
Secondly other none-fencing weapons default better to Knife (if they default to M-G at all).
Thirdly you can use a Long knife with the knife skill. With Sw-1 cutting damage it deals better damage than any of the M-G weapons.

[Der Wanderer]

Originally Posted by Maz

Thirdly you can use a Long knife with the knife skill. With Sw-1 cutting damage it deals better damage than any of the MG weapons.

I think that MG can use all the weapons listed under Knife skill including the Long Knife (Thats my interpretation of the text under MG in MA58, but also if you could only use the weapons listed under one skill with said skill, then Tonfa would be even poorer...)

[Maz]

Originally Posted by Der Wanderer

I think that MG can use all the weapons listed under Knife skill including the Long Knife (Thats my interpretation of the text under MG in MA58, but also if you could only use the weapons listed under one skill with said skill, then Tonfa would be even poorer...)

Ah yes I think you are right in that. I had missed that. The DX/E is still important in some cases though, and so is the defaults.

[Der Wanderer]

Originally Posted by Maz

Ah yes I think you are right in that. I had missed that. The DX/E is still important in some cases though, and so is the defaults.

Agreed, though the Default is depending on what other Melee Skills you have (e.g. if you also have the Shortsword skill) and the difference in difficulty levels might be worth it considering that MG uses Fencing Parry AND ignores Off-Hand penalties to Parry (Effectively +2 to Parry with the Off-Hand)

EDIT: Actually checking the Default List its not in favour of Knife
Knife has Short Sword / MG
MG has Rapier / Saber / Smallsword / Jitte/Sai / Knife

[Blood Legend]

Originally Posted by Der Wanderer

Agreed, though the Default is depending on what other Melee Skills you have (e.g. if you also have the Shortsword skill) and the difference in difficulty levels might be worth it considering that MG uses Fencing Parry AND ignores Off-Hand penalties to Parry (Effectively +2 to Parry with the Off-Hand)

I've always considered the M-G would get a penalty for using the primary hand, since as far as I know the only reason it doesn't get an off-hand penalty is because it is taught to be in that hand to begin with.

And there's definitly a penalty when using your primary hand to use a skill you learned with your left hand. I can crochet (or used to) with a lefthand method, but if I switch the sticks I get all hockie pooky.

[Maz]

Originally Posted by Der Wanderer

Agreed, though the Default is depending on what other Melee Skills you have (e.g. if you also have the Shortsword skill) and the difference in difficulty levels might be worth it considering that MG uses Fencing Parry AND ignores Off-Hand penalties to Parry (Effectively +2 to Parry with the Off-Hand)

I agree, M-G is probably just better.
But then, the same could be said for brawling vs. the other unarmed skills.

I think it might be more a matter of availability. Does the skill even exist in the setting? Either because it simple hasn't been 'invented' yet or is not used by your culture. for instance I doubt M-G is used much around the year 900.


Edit: Blood Legend. No not according to the text in MA p.58.

[Kromm]

Originally Posted by Der Wanderer

@Main-Gauche Skill
Is there anything that the Knife skill can do that the Main-Gauche skill can't?

Use katars and similar punching daggers and spikes, kukris and other heavy chopping knives, and improvised knives such as straight razors and carpet cutters. Anything listed under Knife but not Main-Gauche on p. 228 of Martial Arts truly doesn't work with Main-Gauche; ditto the improvised weapons listed for Knife on p. 224. Also, Knife doesn't suffer the encumbrance penalties to Parry that Main-Gauche, being a fencing skill, does.

Originally Posted by Der Wanderer

@Kakute (MA227)
If the hero wears Kakute on both hands and grapples two handed does the bonus vs. break free stack? Or is the default assumption that Kakute are worn on both hands?

I'd allow +2 vs. break free for a two-handed grapple with two pair of kakute, one on each hand. I don't see it breaking anything, anyway . . . but remember that with two hands suffering from Bad Grip, most other tasks will be troublesome.

Originally Posted by Der Wanderer

@Rokushaku Kama (MA 222)
Does this still use the staff skill?
If yes, should a -1 penalty to hit apply as for the Qian Kun Ri Yue Dao?

"Such attacks use the weapon's usual skill, except as noted" (p. 214); in this case, that means Staff. There's no special skill penalty. The QKRYD has a skill penalty because it's verging on not being a staff. A rokushaku kama is a staff all right -- it just has a little sickle blade at one end.

[Der Wanderer]

Originally Posted by Blood Legend

I've always considered the M-G would get a penalty for using the primary hand, since as far as I know the only reason it doesn't get an off-hand penalty is because it is taught to be in that hand to begin with.

And there's definitly a penalty when using your primary hand to use a skill you learned with your left hand. I can crochet (or used to) with a lefthand method, but if I switch the sticks I get all hockie pooky.

MA pg58 disagrees with you...

[Der Wanderer]

Originally Posted by Kromm

Use katars and similar punching daggers and spikes, kukris and other heavy chopping knives, and improvised knives such as straight razors and carpet cutters. Anything listed under Knife but not Main-Gauche on p. 228 of Martial Arts truly doesn't work with Main-Gauche; ditto the improvised weapons listed for Knife on p. 224. Also, Knife doesn't suffer the encumbrance penalties to Parry that Main-Gauche, being a fencing skill, does.

I'd allow +2 vs. break free for a two-handed grapple with two pair of kakute, one on each hand. I don't see it breaking anything, anyway . . . but remember that with two hands suffering from Bad Grip, most other tasks will be troublesome.

"Such attacks use the weapon's usual skill, except as noted" (p. 214); in this case, that means Staff. There's no special skill penalty. The QKRYD has a skill penalty because it's verging on not being a staff. A rokushaku kama is a staff all right -- it just has a little sickle blade at one end.

Ahh... Thx for the answers that solves these questions... and since Katars rule I will have to go with the Knife skill...

@The first answer: Does this mean the Tonfa skill cannot be used to bash a foe with a short baton?