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Old 12-13-2017, 04:44 PM   #1
Ursus
 
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Default N-scale rail on Ogre/GEV map

Hmmm... I wonder how close a match N-scale train/rail on an Ogre 6E map would be. Or may Z-scale. That's probably too small.
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Old 12-13-2017, 04:58 PM   #2
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Default Re: N-scale rail on Ogre/GEV map

N scale is nearly 200% too large (N is 1:160 in most of the world). Z Scale is still almost 33% too large (1:220 scale).
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Old 12-13-2017, 05:21 PM   #3
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Default Re: N-scale rail on Ogre/GEV map

The closest scale to Ogre is ZZ-scale (which is about 5% too small), but that's very, very hard to come by; I think there's only one company (Bandai), with a very limited catalog (mostly Japanese commuter trains), and may not even be in production any more. Or in short: good luck getting your hands on them for a reasonable price, if at all. Best I found on Ebay with a cursory search was a bullet train engine and a couple pieces of track for $50.

As a community we're probably best off sucking it up and accepting that the two best choices are sprinkling handwavium dust on Z-scale trains...too big, but might not look awful...or getting crafty and making them from scratch.
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Old 12-13-2017, 05:35 PM   #4
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Default Re: N-scale rail on Ogre/GEV map

Nuts..... I was thinking how awesome it would be to have a live train moving on the tracks at some fixed slow pace, or every X minutes, to drive the pace of the game....
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Old 12-13-2017, 06:09 PM   #5
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Default Re: N-scale rail on Ogre/GEV map

This gets into the problem of board game scale vs minis scale again. An ODE game hex is stated as being 1500 meters across -- while the 1:300 minis really would need a hex over 16' to match that scale. Any operating model train on an ODE board would be ungodly overscale.

I'll note there were some air powered trains made in something like 1:1200 about four decades ago by an individual, who wrote up an article on his layout in 'Model Railroader' magazine.
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Old 12-14-2017, 11:23 AM   #6
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Default Re: N-scale rail on Ogre/GEV map

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ursus View Post
Nuts..... I was thinking how awesome it would be to have a live train moving on the tracks at some fixed slow pace, or every X minutes, to drive the pace of the game....
I spent my free time last night digging...one because I love your idea, two because I don't want the "this is what we're finding for caveats" to kill your enthusiasm for something that is really cool, and three because model railroading supplies proper are SO expensive...an N-scale engine is over $200 at retail.

As Mack_JB pointed out, no matter what you do there's going to be a dissonance of mixed scales somewhere, simply because the board's hexes aren't the same scale as the figures...so what works best on your table is going to come down to what is going to be least jarring to your experience.

Compared to Ogre Minis (1:285):
  • T Scale (1:450), 29% too small
  • ZZ-scale (1:300): 5% too small
  • Z-scale (1:220): 29% too big
  • N-scale (1:160): 78% too big

Compared to 6E / ODE Hexes (1.5") / (NS 16/17/1800 specifically):
  • T Scale (1.5"), Just about perfect
  • ZZ-scale (2.25"): 50% too big
  • Z-scale (3.07"): 104% too big
  • N-scale (4.22"): 181% too big

The most Miniatures-friendly train is going to be ZZ-scale, but as previously mentioned getting your hands on that stuff is going to be an internet scavenger hunt. Z and T are off by the same amount, so that gives you options for whether you want a train that is a little too big or a little too small.

The most 6E / ODE hex-friendly train is going to be T-scale; They're the only ones that are going to allow you to drop a single engine in a hex and have it fit...and even then you'll have to buy carefully because some of the engines are still too long.

The most variety is going to be N-scale, but as previously mentioned they're going to be huge compared to the figures and beyond gigantic for the hexes they're supposed to occupy.

C'est la vie.

--------------------------------------

If it were me doing what you're planning on doing, I don't know how often I'd bother scaling to the minis, if ever. In a game like this, with the board scale vs figure scale mismatch, I'm of the opinion of where a figure is for purposes of movement / firing range / etc is a lot more important than the figure being the right size. I can't imagine how many arguments would break out over "No, only the FIRST TWO INCHES of the train count, the rest is overflow because the figure is too big, it's out of range!" "Is not!" "Is too!" "Is not!" "You're a poopyhead!" "Yeah? Well your mama plays Vatican Guard!", or how clumsy it would be moving a 4" train car around 1.5" hexes...especially when it comes to the tiny overlays like ridges and streams.

For the 6E / ODE boards, I'd go with T-scale to match up to the hexes...it's going to look funny compared to the 3D ogre counters, will look fine compared to the other counters, and is going to be the least inconvenient to actually play the game with...meaning more willing to actually play train scenarios.

For Ogre Minis with freeform inch-scale movement [2" per MP]...I'd probably still go with T-scale because of the firing range problem, but would take the time to invest in track and freewheeling bogies from someplace like the spare parts section of tgauge.com, because the train sitting on a track is going to look so much better than just sitting on the terrain.

If I'm playing in oversized hexes (ala Desert Scribe's con event, which if memory serves uses either 4" or 6" hexes), then I'd be looking at bigger trains but it'd come down to an artistic choice. Something like that I'd probably go super-stylized on..."unit" figures that are oversized compared to the terrain so that I could have 'cities' that are a lot of little buildings instead of 2-3 pieces...which makes the question "Is the Train a unit, or a terrain feature? What about the tracks?"

In an oversized hex situation I'd probably wait until I have the cities / etc done, and then order a sample in both T and Z scale, before deciding which looks better on the table.

No matter what, though...I wouldn't personally spend the money on actual model trains. I can't justify $200 for a single engine no matter how cool it's going to make the game look. Instead, I'd hit up Shapeways for body shells, and the Spare Parts section of a model railroad supply stores for the wheels/tracks, kitbash together an entire Ogre train that way for about $20 + shipping.
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Last edited by TheAmishStig; 12-14-2017 at 01:47 PM.
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Old 12-18-2017, 01:50 PM   #7
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Default Re: N-scale rail on Ogre/GEV map

I don't know if this helps your ideas at all, but Brigade Games UK do 2mm (1/1000 scale) railway lines:
http://www.brigademodels.co.uk/Small.../SSS-8023.html

I've not used the stuff myself.
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