Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-06-2015, 02:42 PM   #1
Dark Archon
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Default Dodge and Bombardment

Can I dodge Bombardment Area Attack as normal ranged attack?
Dark Archon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2015, 03:42 PM   #2
mlangsdorf
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Austin, TX
Default Re: Dodge and Bombardment

No, it's an area attack, so you need to Retreat out of it.
__________________
Read my GURPS blog: http://noschoolgrognard.blogspot.com
mlangsdorf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2015, 05:01 PM   #3
evileeyore
 
evileeyore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 100 hurricane swamp
Default Re: Dodge and Bombardment

Quote:
Originally Posted by mlangsdorf View Post
No, it's an area attack, so you need to Retreat out of it.
Diving For Cover under Dodge and Drop B377. Gives one Step before going Prone (hopefully behind cover, but not required to use the option).
evileeyore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2017, 11:11 AM   #4
Sdrolion
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Default Re: Dodge and Bombardment

Apologies for resurrecting something here, but...returning to GURPS after a while away, and was refreshing my memory on some of this stuff. In another forum post a while back (um...seven years ago...), I was questioning Area Attacks and options for dodging them, and asked if it was possible to set up an area attack that attacked people in the area individually and was then dodgeable like ordinary innate attacks. Folks responded that I should look at Bombardment as that was what I wanted.

It's somewhat unclear in the text, but I did kind of feel on rereading that it would be dodgeable - instead of being a true "area" effect it just "attacks" everyone in the area. I.E. Instead of being an "area effect" it has now become a collection of separate "attacks," which could theoretically be dodged.

Here is the relevant forum post from that old discussion: http://forums.sjgames.com/showpost.p...8&postcount=13

I might be misinterpreting something (and only getting -5% off for forcing the skill to roll at 14 and allowing the target to dodge maybe feels a little low...although it's also fairly in line with the later "blockable" limitation, which is worth 5%), but it feels possible that was the intent?

Otherwise...I wonder if it might be reasonable to just create a "dodgable" limitation that's also worth -5% and apply it to regular Area of Effect stuff? Just looking for a way to create an area effect modifier whose only real benefit is that it allows you to simultaneously attack everything in the area - otherwise treating it just like they got attacked by regular ranged innate attacks.
Sdrolion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2017, 11:55 AM   #5
David Johnston2
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Default Re: Dodge and Bombardment

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sdrolion View Post
Apologies for resurrecting something here, but...returning to GURPS after a while away, and was refreshing my memory on some of this stuff. In another forum post a while back (um...seven years ago...), I was questioning Area Attacks and options for dodging them, and asked if it was possible to set up an area attack that attacked people in the area individually and was then dodgeable like ordinary innate attacks. Folks responded that I should look at Bombardment as that was what I wanted.

It's somewhat unclear in the text, but I did kind of feel on rereading that it would be dodgeable - instead of being a true "area" effect it just "attacks" everyone in the area. I.E. Instead of being an "area effect" it has now become a collection of separate "attacks," which could theoretically be dodged.
.
It's a collection of randomly targeted attacks. If the projectiles were slow moving or you could dodge actual bullets in motion then you could dodge them like you were playing a Bullet Hell game. Usually though people don't dodge bullets, they dodge the people aiming the bullets and that doesn't apply to bombardment because they aren't aiming at you but at your general vicinity. So it's a question where your cinematic dial is set.
David Johnston2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2017, 12:16 PM   #6
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
Default Re: Dodge and Bombardment

Note that part of the reason people don't dodge bullets is because they're not really visible fast enough. It takes on the order of a half second to respond to an incoming threat and get out of its way. That's 150-500 yards, depending on the round.

Human visual resolution is about 1"/100 yards, which isn't enough to see a bullet unless it's designed to be seen. Dodging artillery is technically possible (typically visible at about a second out), though of limited value since the blast radius exceeds the distance you can move from a standing start by a lot.
__________________
My GURPS site and Blog.
Anthony is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2017, 12:26 PM   #7
Sdrolion
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Default Re: Dodge and Bombardment

Hrm...see, I was picturing more like a rain of fantasy game fireballs, or a rain of earth spears, or things like that - or at least, that's the attacks I'm kind of trying to model. Things where the attack is against everything in an area, but it matters how good you are at dodging. I.E. the big slow warrior can't get out of the way of the earth spear and just takes it and absorbs the blow, but the quick acrobatic monk sees it come in the air and dodges aside.

The way bombardment is modeled as stated here, it instead seems like it's more of a general probability - like was said, maybe intended for faster projectiles than are normally shown in a lot of fantasy games. The, say, lightning bolt heads for you or it doesn't, but if it does head properly for you, it's too fast and you can't get out of the way.

One way is about the character's ability to dodge, the other is about the probability that a projectile heads for the character. I had thought that bombardment was actually both, but it seems like it is only the latter.

Which I get, and is fine, but if that's the case, how do you model an attack that's slower and dodgeable but affects everything in an area, like the aforementioned earth spears, mana bolts, or what have you? Maybe it's just a matter of house ruling a -5% "can be dodged?" or something like that? Where the net benefit of your modifiers is just "you attack everything in region X, but only once per target?" - and they can still defend normally?

Last edited by Sdrolion; 09-28-2017 at 12:31 PM. Reason: Futher clarification
Sdrolion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2017, 12:53 PM   #8
David Johnston2
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Default Re: Dodge and Bombardment

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sdrolion View Post
Hrm...see, I was picturing more like a rain of fantasy game fireballs, or a rain of earth spears, or things like that - or at least, that's the attacks I'm kind of trying to model. Things where the attack is against everything in an area, but it matters how good you are at dodging. I.E. the big slow warrior can't get out of the way of the earth spear and just takes it and absorbs the blow, but the quick acrobatic monk sees it come in the air and dodges aside.

The way bombardment is modeled as stated here, it instead seems like it's more of a general probability - like was said, maybe intended for faster projectiles than are normally shown in a lot of fantasy games. The, say, lightning bolt heads for you or it doesn't, but if it does head properly for you, it's too fast and you can't get out of the way.

One way is about the character's ability to dodge, the other is about the probability that a projectile heads for the character. I had thought that bombardment was actually both, but it seems like it is only the latter.

Which I get, and is fine, but if that's the case, how do you model an attack that's slower and dodgeable but affects everything in an area, like the aforementioned earth spears, mana bolts, or what have you? Maybe it's just a matter of house ruling a -5% "can be dodged?" or something like that? Where the net benefit of your modifiers is just "you attack everything in region X, but only once per target?" - and they can still defend normally?
Just let them dodge if that's what you want them to do. It's not worth points because the vast majority of targets are crap at dodging anyway.
David Johnston2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2017, 01:34 PM   #9
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
Default Re: Dodge and Bombardment

It's probably a custom limitation to have an attack that can't be dodged normally be dodgeable, and likely more than -5% (assuming dodge is 2 lower than HT on average, I'd eyeball it as -20%, same as a HT-2 resistance roll).
__________________
My GURPS site and Blog.
Anthony is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2017, 06:22 PM   #10
Bruno
 
Bruno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
Default Re: Dodge and Bombardment

Can be Blocked is only -5% so Dodge being no better sounds right to me.
__________________
All about Size Modifier; Grand Unified Hit Location Table
A Wiki for my F2F Group
Bruno is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:24 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.