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Old 03-20-2013, 11:30 AM   #1
Anders
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Default Divine Favor- specific Gods

This is about the supplement Divine Power.

I was thinking about how to customize the system for specific gods. Making special prayers for each god is one option but I thought - what about making the prayers easier if they fit the God's portfolio?

Take a healing god. Lay on Hands is a Major Miracle. Normally this would take a Reaction Roll of Good or better. But this is a Healing god, so you only need a Reaction Roll of Average or better. But the Healing god is opposed to killing stuff, so the Smite miracle (also a Major Miracle) requires a Reaction Roll of Very Good.

Does that sound workable?
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Old 03-20-2013, 11:39 AM   #2
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Default Re: Divine Favor- specific Gods

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Originally Posted by Asta Kask View Post
This is about the supplement Divine Power.

I was thinking about how to customize the system for specific gods. Making special prayers for each god is one option but I thought - what about making the prayers easier if they fit the God's portfolio?

Take a healing god. Lay on Hands is a Major Miracle. Normally this would take a Reaction Roll of Good or better. But this is a Healing god, so you only need a Reaction Roll of Average or better. But the Healing god is opposed to killing stuff, so the Smite miracle (also a Major Miracle) requires a Reaction Roll of Very Good.

Does that sound workable?
I wouldn't change the required reaction level, as per the listings under General Prayer on p5, and the notes in the Box on New Learned Prayers on p9(in particular read the example notes for Walk on Water at the bottom of that box), the Reaction Level is linked to how miraculous the effects are.

The simpler solution is to adjust the Reaction Roll Modifiers (also p5) for how appropriate the Miracle is for a particular god. e.g. A servant of a God of Healing might get a +2/+3 to the Reaction Roll when asking for a Healing Miracle, and -2/3 if asking for a direct damage miracle.

I have a feeling this sort of affinity modifier is mentioned somewhere, but I've no idea where.

EDIT: See Good and Evil box on p12, "Replace the Divine Favor modifiers (p. 5) for situation and paragon behavior with a simple -4 to +4 depending on the degree to which the miracle would further the evil deity’s interests."

Healing miracles would be considered as furthering the interests of a God of Healing, while Direct Damage miracles would be opposed to them (generally).

Last edited by SCAR; 03-20-2013 at 11:44 AM.
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Old 03-20-2013, 11:42 AM   #3
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Default Re: Divine Favor- specific Gods

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asta Kask View Post
This is about the supplement Divine Power.

I was thinking about how to customize the system for specific gods. Making special prayers for each god is one option but I thought - what about making the prayers easier if they fit the God's portfolio?

Take a healing god. Lay on Hands is a Major Miracle. Normally this would take a Reaction Roll of Good or better. But this is a Healing god, so you only need a Reaction Roll of Average or better. But the Healing god is opposed to killing stuff, so the Smite miracle (also a Major Miracle) requires a Reaction Roll of Very Good.

Does that sound workable?
It is very workable plotwise. It sounds workable mechanics wise.
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:04 PM   #4
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Default Re: Divine Favor- specific Gods

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Originally Posted by SCAR View Post

[i]EDIT: See Good and Evil box on p12, "Replace the Divine Favor modifiers (p. 5) for situation and paragon behavior with a simple -4 to +4 depending on the degree to which the miracle would further the evil deity’s interests."
I would go with this. Easy enough to add modifiers to the system without breaking it and your initial idea would change the actual point cost.
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Old 03-21-2013, 01:16 AM   #5
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Default Re: Divine Favor- specific Gods

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I would go with this. Easy enough to add modifiers to the system without breaking it and your initial idea would change the actual point cost.
Patron (Minimal Intervention) notes that a neutral or better reaction on your request for aid results in the patron giving you what it thinks you need (which may or may not be what you want). It doesn't require anything else.

The idea that it requires a better reaction result to get a better granted power is a zero-cost feature of the Divine Favor trait construction. Changing the "reaction result needed to get effect _foo" criteria for a specific god wouldn't change the cost of the trait so long as the reaction result needed was neutral or better.

Swapping out one zero-cost feature out for a different zero-cost feature doesn't result in a point cost change.
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Old 03-21-2013, 03:31 AM   #6
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Default Re: Divine Favor- specific Gods

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Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire View Post
Patron (Minimal Intervention) notes that a neutral or better reaction on your request for aid results in the patron giving you what it thinks you need (which may or may not be what you want). It doesn't require anything else.

The idea that it requires a better reaction result to get a better granted power is a zero-cost feature of the Divine Favor trait construction. Changing the "reaction result needed to get effect _foo" criteria for a specific god wouldn't change the cost of the trait so long as the reaction result needed was neutral or better.

Swapping out one zero-cost feature out for a different zero-cost feature doesn't result in a point cost change.
1. While Divine Favor was based on Patron, it is an entirely new and different ability. I'm pretty sure PK said as much on these forums

2. Divine Favor specifically defines what different Reaction result mean for that advantage (p5), you shouldn't 'interpret' them based on those defined for Patron.

3. The box on p9 'New Learned Prayers' is pretty clear that the point cost, which is bound to the Divine Favor level by the Alternate abilities mechanic, is bound to the Minimum Reaction roll. Specifically the notes and example below the table make it quite clear that a Learned Prayers effect (and how miraculous it is), should be reflected by the Minimum Reaction and therefore the Level of Divine Favour and the Point Cost.
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Old 03-21-2013, 03:52 AM   #7
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Default Re: Divine Favor- specific Gods

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1. While Divine Favor was based on Patron, it is an entirely new and different ability. I'm pretty sure PK said as much on these forums
Then build it out manually, keep the zero-cost features that you desire, remove the ones you don't, add the ones you want and keep on truckin'. None of that affects the pricing of the "Divine Favor" advantage, nor does it affect the pricing of the "Learned Prayers" branched off the "Divine Favor" advantage. You can even keep the name.

Write it out as a "differs from what is published in GURPS Powers - Divine Favor in the following details ..." to save yourself some typing and you're set.
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Old 03-21-2013, 04:04 AM   #8
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Default Re: Divine Favor- specific Gods

The two ideas are mathematically equivalent, so I'll use the official one. I should have guessed that PK wouldn't have overlooked something that obvious.
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Old 03-21-2013, 04:14 AM   #9
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Default Re: Divine Favor- specific Gods

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Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire View Post
Then build it out manually, keep the zero-cost features that you desire, remove the ones you don't, add the ones you want and keep on truckin'. None of that affects the pricing of the "Divine Favor" advantage, nor does it affect the pricing of the "Learned Prayers" branched off the "Divine Favor" advantage. You can even keep the name.

Write it out as a "differs from what is published in GURPS Powers - Divine Favor in the following details ..." to save yourself some typing and you're set.
I really don't get what your point is here.
You tried to use the Patron advantage and specifically Minimal Intervention to cover what reaction roll results would be good for. I was pointing out that you can't do that, and why.

I'm not really interested in the 'zero-point feature' issue, and I'm not sure that was what refplace meant. - As per 'New Learned Prayers, Divine Favor, p9', the point cost of an LP binds it to a level of Divine Favor (standard AA rules), and therefore a Reaction result - for an LP to be in a different Reaction result category, you should modify the LP (in the example, by adding Affects Others to Walk on Water) to bring it into the 'correct' Reaction category.
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Old 03-21-2013, 04:26 AM   #10
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Default Re: Divine Favor- specific Gods

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I really don't get what your point is here.
You tried to use the Patron advantage and specifically Minimal Intervention to cover what reaction roll results would be good for. I was pointing out that you can't do that, and why.
The GM can do that, and it can do that without changing the point cost of anything because the very idea of requiring a reaction better than neutral isn't part of the advantage ... its' merely an added-on feature. Swapping out one feature for another feature doesn't change the point cost.

The GM, in this case, has decided not to do it that way. Awesome.
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