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Old 03-05-2013, 09:11 AM   #1
ericthered
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Default Difference Between Imp and Pi++

I have never understood where, if at all, these two damage types differ. Is it just a convention where Pi++ is understood to be large caliber bullets, or is there something I'm missing?
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Old 03-05-2013, 09:18 AM   #2
vicky_molokh
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Default Re: Difference Between Imp and Pi++

Some old discussion: http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=21899

(And when people say that the wide arrowheads with cutting edges are what an Imp broadhead arrow represent, I keep wondering what Willowleaf arrows doing Cut damage represent then?)
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Old 03-05-2013, 09:19 AM   #3
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Default Re: Difference Between Imp and Pi++

Different ammunition types can shift pi damage up and down the 'size' ranges.
e.g. Armor-Piercing [HT.167]
"reduce damage type: pi++ becomes pi+, pi+ becomes pi, and pi becomes pi- (no effect on pi-)."
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Old 03-05-2013, 09:26 AM   #4
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Default Re: Difference Between Imp and Pi++

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
Some old discussion: http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=21899

(And when people say that the wide arrowheads with cutting edges are what an Imp broadhead arrow represent, I keep wondering what Willowleaf arrows doing Cut damage represent then?)
thanks, I think that discussion covers it. The difference is historical, both in gurps and in history!
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Old 03-05-2013, 10:18 AM   #5
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Default Re: Difference Between Imp and Pi++

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericthered View Post
thanks, I think that discussion covers it. The difference is historical, both in gurps and in history!
Yes. In the third edition, bullet damage did crushing damage... The term piercing, introduced with the fourth edition, was a very good idea.
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Old 03-05-2013, 10:34 AM   #6
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Default Re: Difference Between Imp and Pi++

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericthered View Post
I have never understood where, if at all, these two damage types differ.
Interactions with armor; Imp and Pi++ have different behavior against flexible armor. Other than that, yeah, it's historical.
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Old 03-05-2013, 11:23 AM   #7
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Default Re: Difference Between Imp and Pi++

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
... Imp and Pi++ have different behavior against flexible armor. ...
Do they? I don't see that.

Mechanically, would anything important be lost if imp were replaced by pi++ in the rules?
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Old 03-05-2013, 11:28 AM   #8
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Default Re: Difference Between Imp and Pi++

Quote:
Originally Posted by munin View Post
Do they? I don't see that.
Flexible armor per se has no change in behavior, but most TL 7-9 flexible armor has higher DR against piercing than against impaling.
Quote:
Originally Posted by munin View Post
Mechanically, would anything important be lost if imp were replaced by pi++ in the rules?
You lose the ability to distinguish between them for purposes of armor.
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Old 03-05-2013, 11:32 AM   #9
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Default Re: Difference Between Imp and Pi++

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Originally Posted by munin View Post
Do they? I don't see that.

Mechanically, would anything important be lost if imp were replaced by pi++ in the rules?
See the "High- and Ultra-Tech Armor Table" on p284-5 of the basic set, especially note 1. Modern flexible armour intended to keep out bullets is less effective against stabbing weapons to the extent that armour manufacturers make quite different anti-stab vests, which you'll find on p67 of High-Tech.
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Old 03-05-2013, 03:34 PM   #10
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Default Re: Difference Between Imp and Pi++

They are spelled differently .
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