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 09-25-2017, 09:16 PM #1 David Johnston2   Join Date: Dec 2007 Walls How many dice of damage would it take to shoot through an exterior house wall into someone's head with a decent chance of killing them? What about an apartment wall?
 09-25-2017, 09:48 PM #2 Rupert     Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Wellington, NZ Re: Walls It depends on the wall. An interior drystone wall probably has DR1. A brick or concrete exterior wall could have DR30+, while a timber exterior wall probably has DR2, at best. It also depends where on the head you hit. A person's skull has DR2, and any penetrating damage is multiplied by x4. A hit to the eye with a bullet means no DR and the same damage multiplier. A hit to the face means no DR, but the damage multiplier is that of the attack (pi, pi+, etc.). Thus at the low end we have an attack through an interior wall into the eye - DR1, needing 20 points of damage to force a death check (and thus 4 points of penetrating damage). This requires 1d+2 damage, and a .22 long rifle bullet fired from a rifle is sufficient. At the high end we have a shot through a DR32 (4" thick) brick wall to the face, requiring ~52 points of damage if it's a pi attack, and thus 15d pi. As that's beyond a normal full-bore rifle (pi), let's look at pi+: 32 + 20 / 1.5 = 46 points -> 13d. Not much lower, so we'll check pi++: 32 + 20 / 2 = 42 -> 12d. Realistically you need an anti-tank rifle if you're shooting through that wall, or armour-piercing ammo and a skull/brain hit (7d(2) pi- for a 7.62x51mm APHC round gives ~30 points of damage if you hit the skull through that wall). In conclusion - brick and concrete exterior walls are quite good cover. Interior walls are not. __________________ Rupert Boleyn "A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history."
 09-25-2017, 09:49 PM #3 evileeyore     Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: 100 hurricane swamp Re: Walls What's the exterior wall made of*? And the interior walls? Personally I'd call each 1/2 of sheetrock (wallboard) 1 DR and 2 HP, most interior wall are 2 layers (1 inch) of sheetrock (two separate layers, one of each side). Better built homes (more noise proofed) will be 4 layers, however this is 2 separate layers of 2 on each side of the wall, so 2 DR 4 HP and then another 2 DR 4 HP. The walls between different units in an apartment building should also be 4 layers often times with a mesh screen between (chicken wire) which should add a separate 2/0 DR 4/0 HP (the second number is versus pi). Each layer of sheetrock is 30 minutes fire rated**, so versus fire it has a lot more DR. * Basic Set recommends 6 DR exterior walls for modern buildings, which if made of empty cinder block almost*** sounds right. If it's properly filled with concrete however (which it should be! And reinforced to boot!) that's 6 inches of concrete... which I would treat as brick for blow through purposes only, so DR 16 HP 16. ** Which with only 1 layer drops to mere minutes at seams. This is also why better built homes use multiple layers on each side of a wall, they overlap the seams better to give a greater heat and fire insulation. *** I was popping cinder blocks with a .38 as a kid, so... maybe 6 DR is a leetle high for a 'void' cinder block construction house. And it feels weak for a solid 6-7 inches of reinforced concrete and block , which is what I'd call a 'modern middle class home'. __________________ Feel free to steal, borrow, fold, spindle, mutilate any rule, advantage, etc I come up with it.
 09-25-2017, 10:00 PM #4 evileeyore     Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: 100 hurricane swamp Re: Walls Note, that sheetrock (wallboard, drystone, etc), though stone, should not be treated as Homogeneous or Amorphous. __________________ Feel free to steal, borrow, fold, spindle, mutilate any rule, advantage, etc I come up with it.
 09-25-2017, 10:04 PM #5 Rupert     Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Wellington, NZ Re: Walls But it is homogenous. It just has cruddy HP for its weight (and probably HT). __________________ Rupert Boleyn "A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history."
 09-25-2017, 10:11 PM #6 Buzzardo     Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Austin, TX Re: Walls When I lived in Houston, the gangs had a thing for shooting into each other's houses at knee height, figuring they'd get the kids (as happened once in a while). They'd use AK-47s. So an AK-47 does enough damage to kill through the wall of a house. I don't suppose those walls had more than about DR 10. __________________ Play Ogre? Want an interactive record sheet? Want a random dungeon? How about some tables for that? How about a random encounter? Google Plus Profile
 09-26-2017, 04:40 PM #7 (E)   Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: New Zealand. Re: Walls The series mythbusters had an episode devoted to shooting through walls, a 9mm fired from a pistol went through only fractionally slowed. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth...s_(2015_season) episode; supernatural shooters. __________________ Waiting for inspiration to strike......
 09-25-2017, 09:50 PM #8 (E)   Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: New Zealand. Re: Walls A timber weather board house might have a DR of 3 (one inch of good timber, insulation and then gib board) and a one in ten chance of hitting something harder on the way through. Most of the time the harder material might add a D6 to the DR but there is a slim chance a piece of heavy steel might be in the way. __________________ Waiting for inspiration to strike...... Last edited by (E); 09-25-2017 at 09:54 PM.
 09-26-2017, 08:09 PM #9 malloyd   Join Date: Jun 2006 Re: Walls One side issue is that even if you can see through the wall, you probably can't aim very effectively - multiple layers of variable composition stuff in a typical wall is going to do rather random things to the trajectory of the bullet even if it doesn't slow it down much. I'd probably make you roll as for a miss (as for Hitting the Wrong Target) - your successful to hit roll allowed you to hit the *wall*, not the guy behind it. __________________ -- MA Lloyd
 09-26-2017, 08:39 PM #10 trooper6   Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Medford, MA Re: Walls The 3e adventure campaign Operation Endgame, has a scenario "Operation Midnight" which involved a scene where badguys shoot at the heroes through a wall as part of an ambush. The ambush takes place at a motel bungalow in the Copenhagen red light district. The PCs are brought inside the bungalow and asked to sit on the couch in the lounge while the person who let them in leaves to get the boss. As soon as that person leaves, the ambush begins. Or as the text states: "Three assassins wait in the kitchener, with Uzi submachine guns under their jackets. They open fire through the paper-thin walls. Although the assassins cannot see their targets, they do not have a lot of space in which to miss. Therefore, their shots suffer only a -5 penalty. All assassins use area auto fire to blanket the targets in bullets." That might be of interest.

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