Steve Jackson Games Forums - View Single Post - A (more?) definitive answer on rear attacks and awareness.

Lord Dynel · 12-10-2013, 07:12 PM

Okay, I'll admit I'm a little confused about attacking from the rear hex, whether or not the defender can dodge or not, and whether he's even aware of an attack or an attacker. Well, maybe not all of those issues, but some of them, and how they all mesh together.

I've had a conversation with a player and he's presenting me with a scenario. If his character starts combat in a rear hex behind a foe, who is unaware, he gets an attack against that foe and that foe cannot dodge. We both agree on that.

This is where we disagree. He thinks that if the foe keeps his back to him and he can reload and fire again, he gets another shot on the foe who once again cannot dodge his shot. I think that once he fires that first shot, he is a known attacker, and the foe knows he's back there. The foe could didge, but at a penalty.

But, honestly, I can see his point. B391 does specifically state, "an attack that comes from your back hex, you cannot defend at all unless you have Peripheral Vision...or 360° Vision." That sounds pretty definitive...right?

But in the FAQ, 3.4.3.5 states "The rule is simple. Do you know if you are being attacked? Do you know from where? If both answers are yes, you are aware that you're being attacked, and get a chance to dodge (of course, if you don't actively SEE your opponent, you will incur penalties). If one or both answers are no, you are effectively blind to the attack and cannot dodge." So if the foe knows the attacker (the player) is behind him, and he knows that the attacker is attacking him, is he not considered aware? This is particularly vexing because of its (at least to me) ambiguity - does the foe need to know if he's being attacked in that particular turn, or just in general? Does the foe need to know where from, as in what particular hex?

To expand my thoughts, I think the player can get a defense-free shot against said foe, on that first turn/shot. But once the shot is fired, hit or miss (okay, the player might be able to argue his "unawareness" if the shot misses), the foe knows he's being attacked and from where (though both roughly, admittedly). Any more shots - assuming the foe doesn't turn around and the player stays in a rear hex - would be considered a side attack and the foe could dodge at -4, for not being able to see his defender at all but knows he's back there somewhere, as stated on B394. I do not think the player can sit back and get "un-dodgable" shots against the foe every four (or so) seconds with his crossbow. I think the situation is already heavily favors the attacker as-is but that's my opinion, of course.

And enlightenment would be greatly, greatly appreciated!

12-10-2013, 07:12 PM	#1
Lord Dynel Join Date: Feb 2008	A (more?) definitive answer on rear attacks and awareness. Okay, I'll admit I'm a little confused about attacking from the rear hex, whether or not the defender can dodge or not, and whether he's even aware of an attack or an attacker. Well, maybe not all of those issues, but some of them, and how they all mesh together. I've had a conversation with a player and he's presenting me with a scenario. If his character starts combat in a rear hex behind a foe, who is unaware, he gets an attack against that foe and that foe cannot dodge. We both agree on that. This is where we disagree. He thinks that if the foe keeps his back to him and he can reload and fire again, he gets another shot on the foe who once again cannot dodge his shot. I think that once he fires that first shot, he is a known attacker, and the foe knows he's back there. The foe could didge, but at a penalty. But, honestly, I can see his point. B391 does specifically state, "an attack that comes from your back hex, you cannot defend at all unless you have Peripheral Vision...or 360° Vision." That sounds pretty definitive...right? But in the FAQ, 3.4.3.5 states "The rule is simple. Do you know if you are being attacked? Do you know from where? If both answers are yes, you are aware that you're being attacked, and get a chance to dodge (of course, if you don't actively SEE your opponent, you will incur penalties). If one or both answers are no, you are effectively blind to the attack and cannot dodge." So if the foe knows the attacker (the player) is behind him, and he knows that the attacker is attacking him, is he not considered aware? This is particularly vexing because of its (at least to me) ambiguity - does the foe need to know if he's being attacked in that particular turn, or just in general? Does the foe need to know where from, as in what particular hex? To expand my thoughts, I think the player can get a defense-free shot against said foe, on that first turn/shot. But once the shot is fired, hit or miss (okay, the player might be able to argue his "unawareness" if the shot misses), the foe knows he's being attacked and from where (though both roughly, admittedly). Any more shots - assuming the foe doesn't turn around and the player stays in a rear hex - would be considered a side attack and the foe could dodge at -4, for not being able to see his defender at all but knows he's back there somewhere, as stated on B394. I do not think the player can sit back and get "un-dodgable" shots against the foe every four (or so) seconds with his crossbow. I think the situation is already heavily favors the attacker as-is but that's my opinion, of course. And enlightenment would be greatly, greatly appreciated!