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Old 05-16-2014, 08:50 AM   #28
Varyon
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Default Re: Capping Skill Default Levels

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sindri View Post
Because low skill levels involve a greater percentage of improvement in transferable fundamentals common to all fighting than higher skill levels. There is a substantial difference between someone who has trained in anything and gotten past the initial efficacy valley and someone who hasn't even if the specific weapon isn't being used. Even with the improvement specific to the weapon the basics of similar weapons are more similar than the more advanced parts of the skill.
The things that are truly important in combat are universal, as Kromm has noted. I suppose I could see cause for improved defaults at lower levels (something like "If you have at least [8] points invested in combat skills, Easy combat skills default to a minimum of DX, Average to DX-1, Hard to DX-2, and Very Hard to DX-3"), but not for poor defaults at higher levels.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sindri View Post
You only need one case for it to be problematic. PCs aren't evenly distributed across the population. They have a strong tendency to be the guys who are nigh-unparalleled masters.
True masters are typically a once in a generation (if even that often) affair, so having 5 of them running around together strikes me as cinematic. This is probably just a difference in opinion on what constitutes "cinematic," however.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sindri View Post
Competitive isn't a problem, better is a problem. Up to a point a nigh-unparalleled master should be better than specialists in a weapon he has neglected but past that when dealing with lesser masters in the weapon he should have difficulty. Ideally we want him to try to engage them with his mastery of his chosen weapon where he is strong rather than where they are strong and provide mechanical means for him to do that than for him to simply defeat them because he is so good that even with a weapon he has neglected he is better than masters of that weapon.
First off, the master does have a very good reason to engage his foes with his chosen weapon, because having Skill 26 against a Skill 20 foe is far better than having Skill 22 against that same foe.

Secondly, and the reason I don't see a problem with this situation (as well as part of why I had all skills with at least some level of default in my Overhaul), is the case of one Miyamoto Musashi. Musashi was a master swordsman who traveled Japan challenging other masters of combat - and consistently winning. He used everything from swords (two handed, one handed, or even dual wielding) to improvised polearms to a metal fan. If you have PC's with skills comparable to Musashi, the idea that they could pull off feats similar to him hardly strikes me as a flaw in the system.
Another thing to consider - and germane to the topic of Musashi - is that nobody with any high skill (particularly in a combat skill) is likely to have trained in a vacuum. A character with high Broadsword skill has probably spent some time practicing with some two handed swords, with shorter blades, with swinging his own sword by the blade (using Axe/Mace skill to strike with the hilt), and even in fighting unarmed. I don't think it's necessary to actually charge points for such, instead simply relying on defaults to show that, yes, the character has dabbled a bit in other combat skills.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sindri View Post
This is in fact one of the threads that is proving influential while developing my melee combat defaults.
As noted, some of the defaults there are probably overly generous. Something I didn't mention in that thread was how I envisioned buying up from default - you can buy up a single skill at half price so long as you are within "default range" - so if you had Sword at 20, "default range" for 2H Sword is between 18 (where it's at from defaulting) and 22 (where it becomes the dominant skill, with Sword defaulting from it). How to deal with multiple defaults would probably be a bit hairy (and having not fully worked this out is one of the reason I never got around to posting the defaulting rules in that thread).
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