View Single Post
Old 10-31-2015, 09:58 AM   #10
Icelander
 
Icelander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
Default Re: [Martial Arts] Aquatic Styles: Sahuagin (Shark Men)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc View Post
Judo allows better capabilities for moving other people around in general, with Judo Throw and Sacrifice Throw, which presumably retain their stunning effect even if there is nothing solid to throw the target into because this is not contradicted by RAW as far as I can tell
GURPS Martial Arts: Yrth Fighting Styles p. 22:

"Attacks and techniques that depend on gravity, such as
throws and trips, have limited or no effect underwater; the
GM must adjudicate as required
."

This is a RAW justification for reducing the effectiveness of Judo Throw and Sacrifice Throw underwater. I'm not necessarily arguing that it should be useless, but I do think that it's not realistic or plausible for it to have the same effects in water as on land. So I'm discussing the matter with forumites, in preparation for the next session, where it's probable I should have to adjudicate just such a question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc View Post
(plus throwing into objects to deal damage, into other characters to inconvenience two people in a single action, etc),
That, however, I see as a valid use of throws underwater. On the other hand, mechanically speaking, should we try to model these as Judo Throws instead of uses of Wrestling that include Throws from Locks, Shoving People Around or even Pickup (followed by a throw using Throwing or Throwing Art skill)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc View Post
and provides all the defensive capabilities of Karate to a Judo+Wrestling specialist with a minimal Karate focus (I like some variation among stylists; YMMV).
Clawing and biting is a core skill among sahuagin. Grappling is a complement to the use of their natural weapons. Most of them use Brawling for these natural weapons, it is true, but I find it very strange to imagine a sahuagin who learns Karate, but is not good at striking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc View Post
Also, the realistic technique Evade and the cinematic technique Binding both seem especially useful underwater IMHO and default to Judo but not Wrestling.
Very good points. Evade does default to Aquabatics, which seems extremely useful for a smaller combatant facing larger ones in water, but Binding does not. And sahuagin certainly use nets in combat and bind captives.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc View Post
Wrestling, on the other hand, provides the grappling ST bonus and some techniques that Judo doesn't, so I think a strong case can be made for all of the above with differing foci among individual practitioners and/or sub-schools.
Baron Ak'Zuma developed his personal style and for most of his lifetime has not been prepared to teach it.* As he grew older and knew that he would not live another century, he might have reconsidered this view, at least insofar as it applied to sahuagin who would not grow enough within a century to challenge him.

I'd guess that he might have begun considered teaching the younger among his Baronial Guard the style a some fifteen years ago. Four years ago there was a major upheaval which resulted in the Prince and King above Baron Ak'Zuma dying and him being cut-off from wider sahuagin society. I haven't decided whether he came to a decision to teach his style more widely after that. Finally, some six months ago he would have seen that even teaching all his warriors, including the remaining four of the Baronial Guard, would not really imperil him materially, at least not more than other, more immediate threats.

So we'll say that while there are emerging apprentices in the style and maybe four or five journeymen, for now, Baron Ak'Zuma is the only true master. So, in essence, there is only one school and he is teaching it.

His style is tailored to allow him to defeat larger and stronger sahuagin in a formal 'unarmed'** duel to the death. It's not focused on fighting more than one foe at a time, it includes no use of weapons, nets or ropes and it involves leaving a dead foe and an alive and uncrippled Baron Ak'Zuma.

It would seem that Karate + Wrestling was an excellent foundation of such a style. The Bite Mastery Perk is a core component and other necessary Perks include Skill Adaptation (Brawling techniques default to Karate). That allows Baron Ak'Zuma to do everything with Karate that his fellow sahuagin do with Brawling.

I thought about including Judo, but I still haven't found a lot of uses for it in a game-mechanical sense. Granted, Evade is one vital use. Are there others?

*Because it's meant to allow him to defeat his subordinates in ritual duels to the death when they become large enough to threathen him.
**I.e. using only their claws and teeth.
__________________
Za uspiekh nashevo beznadiozhnovo diela!
Icelander is online now   Reply With Quote