[Tomsdad]

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Hmm?
"Wait-CA double-step into his rear-left hex, then Attack into his rear into CC before he gets his turn. "
So he doesn't get to do anything against our CA (we're Feinting), and when we Attack (with a step into CC), he gets his usual runaround Active Defence from a rear arc, trying to Retreat. If he retreated successfully, he can now make his attack, at which point we're in an Attack state, not CA state.

hang on is it wait-CA double step

or

Wait-feint single step?

Or are you

Feinting-CA (not sure you can do that see above) and just using the double step, and then making another attack with step to get into CC from his flank, or another CA to double step into rear and then into CC?

You point about he can't do anything against you CA "because you're feinting" suggests you're doing the latter?


We're still discussing the primary Wait-and-flank double-action tactic? If we went off on the single-action tactic to the fullest, then my answers are indeed off.

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

And you can't be in CC twice with the double-action tactic; I shouldn't've went on this tangent.

No worries,

You could actually just with normal attacks and they get their defence responses . It's pretty brutal actually, wait - step into CC and grapple the target. He would then get to complete his attack, but he's grappled at that point, you then get you go to do something else probably with an AoA. But best to grapple that knife (to go full circle).

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

We need a picture. By 'step into his rear' I meant stepping towards him, into the rear arc of his CC hex. To reiterate:
First hex of movement is from his front hex into his left-front hex.
Second movement from his left-front to his rear-left hex.
Next turn, step into his rear, within his hex, which meets criteria for both 'Close Combat' (same hex) and his rear arc. You're no longer in his side hex, you're behind him, close enough to choke, or to grab his either arm. I'm not sure if my post is enough to visualise it.

Ah I think you can only step into Rear CC from the rear hex, what you describe would be stepping in to Side CC. (and it's at that point I have an issue with grappling his right had from the direction of his left side hex. (but again question regarding facing in CC in Cam&MA apply here).

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Really, this forum needs a standardised way of naming hexes by letter and number, like squares in chess. How about this?

I'd go with relative ones to the target as it's the target that generally suffers the effects of facing. So moving clockwise starting from 12 o'clock

Front Centre (FC)
Front Right (FR)
Side Right (SR)
Rear (R)
Side Left (SL)
Front Left (FL)

The problem with rear arc and rear hex is that they both include the term rear but rear means different thing at different times in the game. I.e you only have one 'rear' hex, even if your side hexes are in your 'rear' arc

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

I'll try to find them eventually.

Cool like I say I use TG now (and I was always bitt shaky on Cam&MA CC/grappling anyway)

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Sure we do. Especially with longue-ish posts of ours.

no probs

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

That seems counterintuitive to me. If so, people would never feint-pretend making anything other than the Attack they have the highest level in (e.g. Arm Locks for close combat grappler, Spinning Attack with Technique Mastery for strikers etc.)

Well see above for more on this. The reason to feint with a kick at -2 is that a feint kick is a believable feint at reach 1 where as as feint punch at reach 1 doesn't work.

Although as I said earlier if someone had made habit of AoA(l)'s I might allow it, as per feints off shield bashes. But I probably make you take the AoA penalties with the feint, you can't get the benefit of both without while avoiding the negatives).

You can only feint with an arm lock if you have grappled your target first, i.e feint with technique has to conform to the requirement of the technique to be believable (and thus effective feint)

Put it this way you could stand facing me and make the most believable looking back kicks feints in the world but I'll never flinch because I know I'm not in danger form back kick.

I'd have no problem with something feinting off technique they had spent points in though, they've spent the point after all. You also defend with your best skill. However as techniques are by definitions more specialised actions than the primary skill I might you start to penalise people who kept making exactly the same feint over and over again, as per the targeted attack rules.

don't forget feint is also a technique