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Old 11-09-2015, 05:14 PM   #8
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Join Date: Dec 2008
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Default Re: New GURPS Hardcore Battle system (fan made)

Originally Posted by Bibiribobiri View Post
i) The figthing pace is too weird:
On GURPS rules, they will usually attack once every second and defend once every second. In seems odd because no one can keep that pace (just watch an UFC fight, for exemple). Even those who could strike once every second (a experienced fighter, like Anderson Silva), rarely do so and when they do, they do it for only a few seconds.
As ericthered mentions, The Last Gasp (Pyramid 3/44) pretty much solves this problem. I've played in very combat-heavy games that have used this, and the problem you (correctly) identify is rarely anywhere to be found—attacking every second-nonstop, while possible, is a good way to exhaust yourself in a hurry.

Originally Posted by Bibiribobiri View Post
ii) The attacking speed doesn’t depend on the weapon one use:
It also seems odd. That being the case, everyone (who had a bit of money) would just use the heaviest weapon he could wield without penalty. In that case, if wanted to use one-handed weapon optimally, both Tom and Jerry would always choose to use the broadsword.
Thinking in numbers, it would actually make more sense for Jerry to use a heavier weapon, like an axe (proportionally much more damage, no defence), than Tom (proportionally almost the same damage, no defence).
Also, if Jerry used a bastard-sword he would strike as fast as if using a short-sword or a dagger.
A very reasonable concern, but as has already been pointed out, your penalty curve is extremely steep, and also doesn't take into account the way different weapons are used (or even the different ways that one weapon is used). Let's take a shortsword, for example: You can cut with it, or you can thrust with it. Given your attention to this speed problem, I feel comfortable assuming that you would agree that one can thrust with a shortsword (or almost any thrust-capable weapon) more quickly than one can swing with one, yet under your model, the only thing that matters is the user's ST and the weapon's absolute weight. A shortsword still thrusts and swings at the same rate (in your model). So does a broadsword, or a greatsword, or a light horse-cutter, or even a kusari. That seems problematic.

Originally Posted by Bibiribobiri View Post
iii) Shields don’t protect passively.
I 100% agree. It would require one sentence in each of the shield descriptions to identify which body parts they effectively cover in the event of a random location hit. Yes, I can guess / make a fairly reasonable ruling, but it's really just a guess.

That said, I'm not convinced that your attempt to resolve it is going to work well. For one thing, it makes shield damage far, far more complicated (with DR based on margins of success, for example). I get what you're trying to do, and I don't disagree with the sentiment, but I suspect you'll have a hard time finding people willing to put up with it in actual play (and this is coming from someone who's completely redesigned the entire GURPS damage system six times and counting...)

A few other comments:
  1. I don't understand why PP apply immediately, instead of applying prospectively (i.e. starting the turn after you accrue them). Why not have Consecutive Attack #1 be unpenalized, Consecutive Attack #2 have one-attack's worth of PP? (It looks like you do it this way for defenses, where the first defense is unpenalized but successive ones without intervening recovery are penalized.)

    If your goal is to represent heavier weapons being "slower on the draw," then what you should be using is the Matter of Inches rules (Martial Arts pg. 110). Your Combat Example 1 uses the language that Jerry is attacking with his axe "without any preparation," but having a ready weapon is preparation. If he has truly no preparation, then the weapon isn't ready and can't attack (and yes, it's possible and legal to hold a weapon in your hand and it not actually be Ready).

    In fact, the Matter of Inches rules might be a good place to turn for "fixing" your PP assessments, or at least give you a good sense of what else you should consider—in particular, I'd suggest the Relative Weapon Weight and the Swing vs. Thrust (the Absolute Weapon Weight rule has nothing to do with maneuverability of a weapon, and Weapon Length isn't really pertinent here).

  2. It seems like you may be double-counting Shield DB in the event of a Block defense—it "counts" once on the attack, as the attacker has to beat Shield DB in order not to hit the shield, and then it "counts" again on the defense roll.

  3. I don't understand why PP accrued for making a block apply to subsequently making a Dodge or Parry, or for that matter, an attack (and vice versa).

    Originally Posted by Bibiribobiri View Post
    I've never fought like this before. Usually attacking as fast as I could gave me better results :)
    Under the absolute, Basic RAW, this is mathematically correct. Making two unmodified attacks on successive turns is statistically more likely to result in landing at least one of them than taking an Evaluate + Single Attack.

    However, the Last Gasp gives very good reasons not to attack indefinitely.

    Additionally, Evaluate confers other benefits besides its bonus to hit. If your opponent is prone to using Deceptive Attacks or making Feints, it gives you a bonus to resist them (and thus helps keep you alive). If you're only going to get one shot at hitting somebody and you have to make it count, then obviously Evaluating is going to be a good idea.

Originally Posted by Bibiribobiri View Post
Why would someone with ever choose a shortsword over a broadsword? He could do it for roleplaying resons, but not for game mechanic reasons.
For purely game mechanic reasons:
  • Cost. Shortswords are cheaper than Thrusting Broadswords. (And 10,000 shortswords are cheaper than 10,000 thrusting broadswords, if you're equipping an army.)

  • Weight/ST. Weaker characters in particular might shave a bit of encumbrance by using a lighter weapon.

  • Being Tricksy. A ST 12 character starts getting Matter of Inches bonuses when using a Shortsword (MinST 8), so if he's the sort who likes making Feints, this may be a good option.

  • Holdout. It's harder to smuggle a broadsword into somewhere you aren't supposed to have a weapon.

  • Skill Synergies. Shortsword can provide very generous defaults to both Broadsword and Knife. Broadsword provides a generous default to Shortsword, and a rather tougher default to Two-Handed Sword. In addition, the Shortsword skill includes a couple of weapons that can be used at Reach C (particularly the Long Knife), which you won't find in the Broadsword equipment list and which can be very handy if your character is the sort to get up in enemies' faces.

  • Eldritch Wonder. Your character found a magic sword! But it's a shortsword, not a broadsword.
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