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-   -   One Last Shot missile attack (http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=157839)

Steve Jackson 06-09-2018 01:48 PM

One Last Shot missile attack
 
Right now the rule says that you have to drop your weapon if you take the One Last Shot option.

I'm very inclined to delete that. It forces a decision that should be left tot he player. In fact, the archer would be more likely to hold onto his bow even if only to defend with!

Any counterarguments?

Jim Kane 06-09-2018 01:59 PM

Re: One Last Shot missile attack
 
Yes, for precisely the rationale you stated in 1980; being: defending with a bow would destroy it as a functional weapon. So while the player *could* choose this as an option; but the weapon should be destroyed after-the-fact, if they use a bow for a purpose for which is not designed.

JK

Skarg 06-09-2018 02:44 PM

Re: One Last Shot missile attack
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Jackson (Post 2181712)
Right now the rule says that you have to drop your weapon if you take the One Last Shot option.

I'm very inclined to delete that. It forces a decision that should be left tot he player. In fact, the archer would be more likely to hold onto his bow even if only to defend with!

Any counterarguments?

I agree. I always took it as an overstatement for simplicity's sake, and to underline the point that you can't just stand in the front lines repeatedly shooting people who are attacking you with hand weapons. You probably shouldn't be able reload a bow or crossbow or sling if you're attacked (or you could just say, while engaged), but I think you should have the option to hold onto it if you want.

I tend to think similarly about entering Hand to Hand combat - a non-HTH weapon could possibly be held onto, even if it did no good or possibly got in the way.

The destroyed rule was also unclear whether it meant you could Defend with a bow that was previously "destroyed" by defending with it, or not. Some people felt a bow would possibly be shredded after a turn of defending against a sword (maybe not a spear), but a crossbow might last longer as a something you can defend with. But it's a bit fiddly and an unusual level of detail for TFT to specify exactly what happens when different things are used to Defend. It's not entirely clear what the rule means though.

JLV 06-09-2018 04:23 PM

Re: One Last Shot missile attack
 
Maybe a better question from us would be: "How does the new rule actually read?"

As it stands, I don't feel strongly about it either way; I always assumed he dropped the weapon so he could free his hands to do something else (ready a melee weapon, for example), but I can see the point about "forcing" an action on the player. The actual phrasing of the new rule might help us understand what you are visualizing here.

Jim Kane 06-09-2018 04:55 PM

Re: One Last Shot missile attack
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Skarg (Post 2181723)
...a crossbow might last longer as a something you can defend with...

And are you including the bowstring as part of the weapons functional duration after attack in your supposition regarding a crossbows' ability to perhaps "last longer"?

My feeling is: honed steel edges and bow strings - of any variety - do not tend to mix well... for the string that is. ;-)

JK

Steve Jackson 06-09-2018 05:15 PM

Re: One Last Shot missile attack
 
The proposal is just to delete the sentence in the option that requires the weapon to be dropped. So it would read:

(l) ONE-LAST-SHOT MISSILE ATTACK. If the figure had a missile weapon ready before it was engaged, it may get off one last shot. The missile weapon must be dropped next turn. (This option reflects the fact that you can almost always release an arrow at a charging enemy.)

The option currently (m) under Engaged Figures says:
(m) CHANGE WEAPONS. Shift one hex (or stand still) and drop ready weapon (if any), and ready a new non-missile weapon. (An engaged figure cannot ready or reload a missile weapon.)

The below remains unchanged:
A figure must have a physical weapon (staff, sword, club, etc.) in hand in order to defend; this weapon is used for parrying. You may “parry” with a bow or crossbow – but it will be ruined!

Rick_Smith 06-09-2018 05:27 PM

Re: One Last Shot missile attack
 
Hi Steve, everyone.
It seems to me that a certain amount of parrying is assumed to happen when two figures are trading blows. A figure with a DX of 12 could hit 100% of the time against a human sized dummy, but he only hits 72% of the time vs. a normal opponent.

So if I have a kick ass bowman, and a guy runs up and engages me, why don't I just ignore him and keep firing my brutal bow of magical slaying? Presumably because I WANT to have some sort of defence.

I would either prefer to keep the rule as it is, or give the guy with a sword a bonus for attacking the bowman who is ignoring any melee defence.

Warm regards, Rick.

Jim Kane 06-09-2018 06:01 PM

Re: One Last Shot missile attack
 
Steve - Why not consider simply changing *must* to *may*?

To potentially read:

(l) ONE-LAST-SHOT MISSILE ATTACK. If the figure had a missile weapon ready before it was engaged, it may get off one last shot. The missile weapon MAY be dropped next turn in order to ready a new weapon. (This option reflects the fact that you can almost always release an arrow at a charging enemy.)

JK

Dave Crowell 06-09-2018 06:38 PM

Re: One Last Shot missile attack
 
I was going to make the same suggestion Jim Kane did. Give the option of dropping the bow after loosing that one last shot. I would take the option unless I was in the dire circumstance of having no other weapon with which to defend myself, in which case swatting and blocking with the bow is better than nothing, but I agree the bow won't be much good after.

Kirk 06-09-2018 08:06 PM

Re: One Last Shot missile attack
 
I think this might work without undue consequences, and would allow a character that seriously wanted to retain his bow to do so in following turns, perhaps to disengage and run, etc.

My understanding was that dropping a weapon did not take an option and effectively used no combat time, so if the character wanted to change weapons, he could still do it in a subsequent turn without penalty for holding onto his bow.

The key, IMO, would be to be clear about not being able to load or use a missile weapon while engaged, cuz ain't nobody got time for that! :)

And, of course, retain the rule that if a missile weapon is used to parry, etc. it is destroyed in the process (perhaps clarify whether it can continue to used as such).


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