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-   -   Disguising a weapon as a toy (http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=164070)

WaterAndWindSpirit 06-09-2019 03:28 PM

Disguising a weapon as a toy
 
What skill could be use to paint a weapon to look like a toy (from a bright girly toy weapon to the legally mandatory orange tipped barrel end of legitimate airsoft guns, that's the easy part ad probably doesn't require a skill roll) and then pretend it's just a toy (acting like it's just a toy is probably the hardest part)?

What skills could be used to spot such a disguised weapon from a distance, aside from the obvious like Observation? Soldier or IQ based guns to notice it's weight is more in line with a real gun than a replica? Body Language to realize the person carrying it is inconvenienced as if it was heavier than a regular toy? Of course anyone holding it for even a second would notice it's not a toy, and metal detectors (unless you're using an Ultra-Tech plastic/polymer gun or something) would be set off by it.

Speaking of, any Ultra-Tech society that has the means of making non-metallic weapons probably have some assassination guns and bullets designed to look like toys and not set off metal detectors. How much extra would such a professional weapon cost? Would it impact the stats negatively?

maximara 06-09-2019 04:06 PM

Re: Disguising a weapon as a toy
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by WaterAndWindSpirit (Post 2267869)
What skill could be use to paint a weapon to look like a toy (from a bright girly toy weapon to the legally mandatory orange tipped barrel end of legitimate airsoft guns, that's the easy part ad probably doesn't require a skill roll) and then pretend it's just a toy (acting like it's just a toy is probably the hardest part)?

What skills could be used to spot such a disguised weapon from a distance, aside from the obvious like Observation? Soldier or IQ based guns to notice it's weight is more in line with a real gun than a replica? Body Language to realize the person carrying it is inconvenienced as if it was heavier than a regular toy? Of course anyone holding it for even a second would notice it's not a toy, and metal detectors (unless you're using an Ultra-Tech plastic/polymer gun or something) would be set off by it.

Speaking of, any Ultra-Tech society that has the means of making non-metallic weapons probably have some assassination guns and bullets designed to look like toys and not set off metal detectors. How much extra would such a professional weapon cost? Would it impact the stats negatively?

The scary thing is we may be at this level right now:

"What is a 3D printed gun, and how is it legal? Your questions, answered" (USAToday)

Kale 06-09-2019 05:39 PM

Re: Disguising a weapon as a toy
 
It's a bit like the Trojan Horse: The first one worked great, but the successive ones less so. A weapon disguised like a toy might be ignored or overlooked by authorities initially, but after a couple high-profile murders or assassinations they will be more likely to shoot first and check the 'toy' later. Politics aside, police in some jurisdictions are developing a reputation for opening fire on any individual holding a vaguely gun-shaped object, toy or not. In comparison, in the mythical 1950's kids ran around with cap guns 'shooting' at all sorts of things without raising eyebrows. Your character's mileage with the 'toy' idea will depend on the society around them.

The Colonel 06-09-2019 07:11 PM

Re: Disguising a weapon as a toy
 
May be an urban myth but I've heard that some US criminals already do disguise their weapons as toys so that police officers will hesitate before opening fire. Of course, if your plan involves getting into a standup fight with the police and needs a few seconds of hesitation to make it work...

Anaraxes 06-09-2019 08:08 PM

Re: Disguising a weapon as a toy
 
Making the weapon look like a toy would be Artist -- Painting for trompe l'oeil, Sculpting and possibly Woodworking to actually reshape the parts if that's needed, Armoury to not screw up the actual functioning bits ("sure, I'll just drill holes all down the barrel to match the pattern on this toy...").

"Selling" the fake toy would be Fast-Talk or Acting.

Verjigorm 06-09-2019 08:52 PM

Re: Disguising a weapon as a toy
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by The Colonel (Post 2267900)
May be an urban myth but I've heard that some US criminals already do disguise their weapons as toys so that police officers will hesitate before opening fire. Of course, if your plan involves getting into a standup fight with the police and needs a few seconds of hesitation to make it work...

Given the frequency at which unarmed people are shot by police who "thought" they saw a gun, I'm not sure this is really something criminals are trying to do.

adm 06-09-2019 09:07 PM

Re: Disguising a weapon as a toy
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by The Colonel (Post 2267900)
May be an urban myth but I've heard that some US criminals already do disguise their weapons as toys so that police officers will hesitate before opening fire. Of course, if your plan involves getting into a standup fight with the police and needs a few seconds of hesitation to make it work...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Verjigorm (Post 2267913)
Given the frequency at which unarmed people are shot by police who "thought" they saw a gun, I'm not sure this is really something criminals are trying to do.

Agreed, US Police forces have serious legal protections* that allow them to generally shoot first if they believe that they or the public is at risk.

*The protections are not with out cause, a better review process would be nice, but tricky to actually implement.

evileeyore 06-09-2019 09:43 PM

Re: Disguising a weapon as a toy
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by The Colonel (Post 2267900)
May be an urban myth...

Eh?

No, it's real. I remember it starting back in the mid '90s. The earliest news report I can find though is from 2006 and that's about Mayor Bloomberg fighting with a gun manufacturer that was deliberately painting handguns to look like fakes. So if a gun manufacturer was getting in on the action, you know the idea had been kicking around for awhile.

Anthony 06-09-2019 09:55 PM

Re: Disguising a weapon as a toy
 
Generally speaking real weapons will be much heavier than toys, and probably differently sized since most toys are made for children and thus have child-sized parts. The disguise will also get damaged quite rapidly if the weapon is actually used, as your disguise parts are unlikely to appreciate either the heat or the exhaust gases.

Verjigorm 06-09-2019 10:00 PM

Re: Disguising a weapon as a toy
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by evileeyore (Post 2267918)
Eh?

No, it's real. I remember it starting back in the mid '90s. The earliest news report I can find though is from 2006 and that's about Mayor Bloomberg fighting with a gun manufacturer that was deliberately painting handguns to look like fakes. So if a gun manufacturer was getting in on the action, you know the idea had been kicking around for awhile.

The hypebole is inaccurate, Lauer gun colorings kits are not intended to look like "fakes", but to provide color options for a firearm as well as a protective finish. Initially it started out as a way to make high visibility firearms that could be easily identified by range officers, and then people started getting a bit wild with making all sorts of aesthetic decisions: I have a friend whose AR-15 is called "deadpool" and has a black and red coloring scheme reminiscent of the marvel superhero Deadpool.

Painting an AR-15 a bright neon color doesn't make it look like a "not-ar 15" at all.


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