Steve Jackson Games Forums

Steve Jackson Games Forums (http://forums.sjgames.com/index.php)
-   The Fantasy Trip (http://forums.sjgames.com/forumdisplay.php?f=100)
-   -   Critical success/failure table, p 9 (http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=160917)

RobW 12-03-2018 04:02 PM

Critical success/failure table, p 9
 
The text says this is weighted towards critical failures on very hard tasks.
But that is a misleading understatement...

A 6d roll is the norm for attacks against a defending weapons master.
for 6 dice: 14 and below = success; 24 and up = failure
According to anydice.com, critical failure is therefore expected 28% of the time.

for 8 dice: 20 and below = success; 28 and up = failure.
And according to anydice.com, 28 and up should occur 54% of the time. That seems harsh.

hcobb 12-03-2018 04:45 PM

Re: Critical success/failure table, p 9
 
Note that the most common 8-die roll is against DX plus ST to jump a megahex (page 104). So an IQ 8 human (or IQ 10 with Acrobatics) maxes out their jumping potential after adding 3 points to either ST or DX.

Olympic class jumpers just take four levels of Acrobatics? http://www.hcobb.com/tft/new_spells.html#Talents

platimus 12-03-2018 05:50 PM

Re: Critical success/failure table, p 9
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RobW (Post 2226142)
The text says this is weighted towards critical failures on very hard tasks.
But that is a misleading understatement...

A 6d roll is the norm for attacks against a defending weapons master.
for 6 dice: 14 and below = success; 24 and up = failure
According to anydice.com, critical failure is therefore expected 28% of the time.

for 8 dice: 20 and below = success; 28 and up = failure.
And according to anydice.com, 28 and up should occur 54% of the time. That seems harsh.

One mans harsh is another man's perfect!

guymc 12-07-2018 07:42 AM

Re: Critical success/failure table, p 9
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RobW (Post 2226142)
The text says this is weighted towards critical failures on very hard tasks.
But that is a misleading understatement...

A 6d roll is the norm for attacks against a defending weapons master.
for 6 dice: 14 and below = success; 24 and up = failure
According to anydice.com, critical failure is therefore expected 28% of the time.

for 8 dice: 20 and below = success; 28 and up = failure.
And according to anydice.com, 28 and up should occur 54% of the time. That seems harsh.

Yes, Iíd have to say that attacking a weapons master who is actively defending SHOULD be dangerous. If the weapons master is defending, they are going to be turning aside or binding the attackerís weapon a lot. This is going to result in a lot of dropped or broken weapons ó and a WHOLE lot of failed attacks. Thatís what defending is for.

larsdangly 12-07-2018 09:06 AM

Re: Critical success/failure table, p 9
 
There's some stuff you can't munchkin your way out of! Anyway, I thought these were the auto failure intervals, not the numbers that lead to dropped or broken weapons. Isn't that right?

hcobb 12-07-2018 09:28 AM

Re: Critical success/failure table, p 9
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by larsdangly (Post 2226988)
There's some stuff you can't munchkin your way out of! Anyway, I thought these were the auto failure intervals, not the numbers that lead to dropped or broken weapons. Isn't that right?

Page 9: "If you roll exactly the failure number, you “merely” fail. A roll above that is a critical failure. Note that the numbers are weighted toward critical failure on extremely hard tasks!"

The problem with this table is that success grows by three but failure only grows by two. So a 16 die roll of 44 is an automatic success and an automatic failure.

larsdangly 12-07-2018 11:09 AM

Re: Critical success/failure table, p 9
 
Good; leave it. I think if the GM makes you attempt a 16 die roll then he or she should be obligated to explain what it means for the roll to both succeed and fail.

hcobb 12-11-2018 06:22 PM

Re: Critical success/failure table, p 9
 
Problem is that the harder a task is the less the character's attributes and talents matter. At higher levels of difficulty it's just random chance.

BTW: If you must succeed and have a zero stat then add difficulty to the task so you can roll more dice.
2-dice auto succ: 2.78%
3-dice 4.63%
4-dice 5.40%
5-dice 5.88%
6-dice 6.08%
7-dice 6.12%
8-dice 6.07%

So increasing the task from a 2-die roll to a 6-die roll more than doubles your chance of success.

Or a more practical example:
Grumpy the 2nd
ST 11 DX 6(1) IQ 15
Quarter-staff(1d+2/1d) Plate armor(5)
Staff I-IV, but no quarterstaff talent

Not having the weapons talent increases his chance of hitting and he's immune to critical failures.

platimus 12-11-2018 10:29 PM

Re: Critical success/failure table, p 9
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hcobb (Post 2227896)
Problem is that the harder a task is the less the character's attributes and talents matter. At higher levels of difficulty it's just random chance.

Yeah, I don't have a problem with that. As for increasing the chance of crit-success with #of die, I actually prefer to keep the crits simple and stationary (success=3 or less, failure=18 or more).

What seems important for a scaling table of crit success/failure is that the chance for crit failure should be greater than the chance for crit success for 4+ die tests. The table on p.9 accomplishes this for 5+ die tests. I guess 4-die tests are common enough to justify keeping the crit-success% = crit-failure%.

#d...crit-success%...vs...crit-failure%
2d.....2.78 vs 2.78
3d.....4.63 vs 4.63
4d.....5.40 vs 5.40
5d.....5.88 vs 15.20
6d.....6.08 vs 27.94
7d.....6.12 vs 41.42
8d.....6.07 vs 54.05
...Assuming 44 or less for success and 44+ for failure....
16d...4.61 vs 96.66
^ No, that doesn't make sense to me. LOL Statistics rarely do at the extreme ends of a spectrum! I'm going to cite "Platimus' Law of Infinity" - As you approach infinity, nothing makes sense and I get a headache! LOL

Maybe "I'm doing it wrong" but check it out on anydice.com.

TedT 10-28-2020 10:54 PM

Re: Critical success/failure table, p 9
 
Critical Success and Failure on 5 Dice

Have any of you a "widely-accepted" table showing Critical Success and Failure rolls on 5 dice? Somewhere from my TFT past I have a list for these steps on 4 dice, but my GM has - as of late - been throwing 5-dice variety obstacles at us. And I want to know when my to-hit roll does, say, double damage on one of his boorish thugs, in such a way as to make him accept its certified provenance.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:22 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.